www.jetgroove.com

[anx]

ok this is ****ed

they are stealing tracks off soulseek or whatever and selling them, without any of the artists consent of course

http://www.globalunderground.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?t=8527&postdays=0&postorder=asc&star t=0

they have a ton of anxious
tones of dave the drummer
glenn wilson
the list goes on
pretty much type any artist in there and you can download high quality files
they cover hard techno to trance to anything

not cool....

[anx]

maybe i should post this in the general section (if it hasnt been already)

[markus]

Are you sure that the labels aren't getting royalties for this?

[Dustin Zahn]

I was actually informed about this tonight by roommate. I did a search and found multiple things by Ian and I on there. Some of which are abiotic material that have not been approved at ALL! Gaetano Parisio was in town tonight so I didn't do anything about it and went to the club instead. Rest assured come tomorrow morning I am going to be making some phone calls. I'm sure there is no real money to be had but I'm doing it for the principal of things.

[markus]

Hmm, nevermind. I just found my own records on there and I was never informed of this.

WTF!?

[markus]

One thing I did notice, when you try to purchase a lot of the tracks on there you'll get a message saying "These tracks are not available for purchase at the moment. You can leave them in your basket and we will inform you by mail when they become available."

So maybe they have them available for preview, but are still waiting to get a hold of certain labels to discuss royalties and licensing and all that jazz.

[schlongfingers]

Yeah the tracks aren't available for download apparently - seems they are adding releases to gather members... a bit dodgy imho but I doubt it's illegal.

[Patrik]

Yes this is what they said last night after we´d contacted them:


Dear Sirs and Madams,

My name is Ulukman Mamytov and I am the attorney for jetgroove.com.

I bring you apologies from JetGroove for making you worry about your copyrights infringements and your music repertoire being presented on our website. I want to assure you that jetgroove.com having started a new Online Music Download Service pursues the objective of making your music more wellknown and accessible and ONLY BY LEGAL MEANS.

That means we DO NOT SELL any of your music without obtaining a proper permission (License) from you or other respective rightholders. You can easily check this by trying to purchase any of you music. Everything that you choose to put in your cart will have status: "Not Available For Purchase Yet". It could only be put "ON HOLD". And we do not change that status untill the contract is signed and your permission is granted. In this case all of your music will be given "Allowed for Selling" status and people who have it in their shopping carts will be able to buy it.

The experince of showing your music on our website without distributing aimed to draw your attention to us, with further goal to make contacts with you on friendly terms with a perspective of mutually beneficial partnership. We’re glad to inform you that your music is getting popular indeed through our website and we can let you know at any time how many of your tracks were put on hold and which ones.

However, we deeply understand your concerns and would like to assure you, if you find our relationships impossible, we will IMMEDIATELY delete all of your music from our music collection.

Hope you’ll find our offer to make your music more popular through us rather reasonable and we can start that mutually beneficial partnership.

Very Truly Yours,

Ulukman Mamytov

Jetgroove LLP
Legal Department

[Bas Mooy]

got the same reply after sending them a pissed off email...lot of our material on there also...bastards...never asked any kind of permission...what to do next?

[schlongfingers]

got the same reply after sending them a pissed off email...lot of our material on there also...bastards...never asked any kind of permission...what to do next?


Email them and ask them to remove your music. Though if I'm being honest I think this is a knee jerk reaction. There's a nice discussion going on at No Future regarding Jetgroove as well.

http://www.no-future.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?s=&threadid=10694

[eyes without a face]

seems like a very dodgy outfit to me

[schlongfingers]

seems like a very dodgy outfit to me

Why's that? It seems extremely clear to me. Fear of change is never a good thing.

[serox]

wow what a great idea.

instead of them contacting every label/artist. you contact them.
i love it:)

the site is not really selling anything, but it looks like it has scared a few people. I am sure they will get a few emails and from there on they could start a business deal.

nice.

[S/E]

I think it is worth it to at least attempt to make an arrangement with these guys. Of course, if they ARE selling your stuff without your permission and you can verify this, then pursue legal action by all means.

[Agent Orange NYC]

Ya they had alot of our Gotham Grooves stuff on there too. I got that response as well. Kinda shady...

[schlongfingers]

wow what a great idea.

instead of them contacting every label/artist. you contact them.
i love it:)

the site is not really selling anything, but it looks like it has scared a few people. I am sure they will get a few emails and from there on they could start a business deal.

nice.

Very, very true - it's really down to their customer service now. They'll get ranked highly on all search engines because of the breadth of text content, and the amount of work potential labels have to put in is so minimal it's laughable really. I can understand why label owners may be put off initially, but I think this is mainly because it's not been approached in the conventional manner - but the publicity this site has generated within three days of launch is pretty stupendous. Some very good thinking at this company in my humblee opinion.

Company A

"Hello this is company xyz, we're launching a new service, all we need you to do is encode all your back catalogue in high quality mp3, provide all your label images, release information and sign this contract, then we need you to upload them all in 'this' format. Oh, ok, well if you change your mind....beep, beep, beep"

Company B

"Hello, this is just to let you know about a new service we've launched, if you take a look at http://www.xy.com/yourlabel you'll see that we have added all information for all your releases for you already. You might be interested to know that ten people have already added your music to their accounts - all we need you to do is to fax us back a signature and we'll activate your account."

Which is better?

[serox]

agreed. very smart planning. great way to launch a site. it has done every thing it could have wanted.

i am guessing this is not the only site/business they run.

[zaalmoetlos]

quote]

Very, very true - it's really down to their customer service now. They'll get ranked highly on all search engines because of the breadth of text content, and the amount of work potential labels have to put in is so minimal it's laughable really. I can understand why label owners may be put off initially, but I think this is mainly because it's not been approached in the conventional manner - but the publicity this site has generated within three days of launch is pretty stupendous. Some very good thinking at this company in my humblee opinion.

quote]

a good way to piss off everybody in the scene and to generate potential lawsuits

[serox]

a good way to piss off everybody in the scene and to generate potential lawsuits

lawsuit wont get far at all. they have not done anything illegal. check there disclaimer.

[dirty_bass]

It`s like setting up an electrical shop.
everyone comes in and goes, oh, I`d like one of them flat screen TV`s.

"Oh, well we don`t actually have any yet......"
Any company that starts off by selling nothing but "air" strikes me as a little bit hooky to begin with.

[serox]

It`s like setting up an electrical shop.
everyone comes in and goes, oh, I`d like one of them flat screen TV`s.

"Oh, well we don`t actually have any yet......"
Any company that starts off by selling nothing but "air" strikes me as a little bit hooky to begin with.

its a bit cheeky in a way, but a good idea which has worked. they have not ripped anyone off.

[zaalmoetlos]

It`s like setting up an electrical shop.
everyone comes in and goes, oh, I`d like one of them flat screen TV`s.

"Oh, well we don`t actually have any yet......"
Any company that starts off by selling nothing but "air" strikes me as a little bit hooky to begin with.

its a bit cheeky in a way, but a good idea which has worked. they have not ripped anyone off.


they may not have ripped anyone of yet but they have certainly pissed off a lot of people

[MARKEG]

well that's all totally crazy. what a way of working. pretend to sell everyone's tracks, get them pissed off and then somehow get them to do business with you.

this is pretty genious actually. they just put anything they can find on the site and wait for you to contact them. and this is why it's working, creating a stir: everyone in the underground industry is scared about mp3 downloads and they think to themselves, I'm going to have to do business with these people, just to survive.

well i say f that. that's just damn right cheeky. think about the principle of the thing. surely there's a way that a site could be set up that acually cares about the artists and the music they're selling. so we don't have to deal with people like this.

but now i think deeper about this, this is not going to work. as a punter you go on there and see the tracks you want and get constant 'not available'. what type of customer is going to visit the site again?

it seems fundamentally flawed. i really wouldn't worry too much about them.

[Miromiric]

and lots of other ppl could get ideas and not have items in stock unavailable!

[g]

just spoke to hawtin and his label guy and sent a note to dj bone. we'll see what happens. sounds like a backward marketing idea that's going to bite them in the azz.

[Miromiric]

EVERYONE in the business is alert by this hour.

[dirty_bass]

I say storm the castle, kill everyone, decapitate the baron!!!

[eyes without a face]

of course its dodgy schlongfingers, anyone who falsely advertises tracks for download (tracks they havent asked permission to use!) and then turns around and says "actually, we dont have any of the files, but we are hoping now we've advertised them without the producers permission that the said producers are going to give us all their music!" is definately up to something fishy in my book

try putting these words into a sentance to get my personal view on the cheeky blighters

pole, barge, wouldnt, with, it, touch and ten foot

:)

[Evil G]

i figure they are on very unstable legal ground. think of it this way; somebody is searching for a dave the drummer track, and is drawn to these guys' web site because the search engine registers a match. they go to the site and find that the dave the drummer track isn't really for sale, but since they are in the store, they find something else to buy.

even though the artists track isn't being sold, it's still being used to draw potential customers in. that's the same thing as putting someone's name on a flyer without talking to them first. people come to hear them, they aren't there, but oh well, it's a party. how would you like it if you had to scan for flyers with your name on them, then call up the promoter and say, ya, i guess since i'm on the flyer, i'll play your party. as if!

[jam]

thats a great idea that



evil as **** though and i bet these people have no care for the music industry and that people feed there families with there music.



good bussiness idea though if you have no morals or are down right evil

[Internal Error Records]

i say sue them. my lawyer says enjoy the free publicity and set up a liscense with them.


the have done wrong and can be sued. they dont need to have sold units to have performed fraud and mis representation. they are also potentialy breaking criminal laws just not civil.

and i settledown i'll probably go with the advise of my lawyer.

[The Divide]

I don’t like it because it’s the sale of mp3's, I don’t see why the industry should compromise sound quality for ease of download.

I would be more supportive if they sold wave files in a world where we are on million meg a second connection shiz. .

[Miromiric]

they obviously download tracks from soulseek or similiar appz. just look at the names of the EPs, reminds me of nomenclature ways of those illegal cracking/warez groups.

[schlongfingers]

of course its dodgy schlongfingers, anyone who falsely advertises tracks for download (tracks they havent asked permission to use!) and then turns around and says "actually, we dont have any of the files, but we are hoping now we've advertised them without the producers permission that the said producers are going to give us all their music!" is definately up to something fishy in my book


"i figure they are on very unstable legal ground. think of it this way; somebody is searching for a dave the drummer track, and is drawn to these guys' web site because the search engine registers a match. they go to the site and find that the dave the drummer track isn't really for sale, but since they are in the store, they find something else to buy.

So therefore this is illegal? http://www.nuloop.com/Result2_e.php?artistget=&label=BLACKOUT&Styl=all&T itre=&ref=&image.x=0&image.y=0

I don't see the difference here, aside from the option for label owners to opt out - it's is cutting out the distributor, but maybe that's the price of deleopment? Direct sale.

[eyes without a face]

i dont think anyone is disputing the legality of the service (although id put a tenner on the people behind it being on the wrong side of legal!), selling mp3's for download is commonplace these days, its more the methods that have been employed by Jetgroove.

i dont get ur point tho? you've linked us to an online record store? as far as im aware nuloop is a legitimate online record store and the sales of Blackout Audio records are all legal?

someone feel free to correct me if i am wrong obviously... as far as i can see its just a normal online record store?

[eyes without a face]

that should of read "i dont think many people are disputing the legality of the service" because obviously people have mentioned if its illegal or not

just before anyone picks up on that haha

[g]

posted this over in dark/exp but just for the sake of thread-friendliness..

some interesting info from mateo murphy:

as those of you who are familiar with allofmp3.com may know, in Russia they have what's called a compulsory licensing law which means that you simply have to make a payment to the appropriate body to sell music online, without requiring permission of the label owner. the thing is that, while they have the right to sell, you don't necessarily have the right to buy because the rest of the world doesn't have the same law and purchase of music is subject to the laws of the buyers country.

[schlongfingers]

i dont get ur point tho? you've linked us to an online record store? as far as im aware nuloop is a legitimate online record store and the sales of Blackout Audio records are all legal?

someone feel free to correct me if i am wrong obviously... as far as i can see its just a normal online record store?

Every single Blackout release on that store is 'out of stock' and contains an 'add to wishlist' button (as for 99% of the music listed on the Nuloop website) - this is in essence EXACTLY the same as what Jetgroove are doing.

[eyes without a face]

no its not, because nuloop is an online record store that sells records in the legal way i.e deals with distribution companies, everything is above board, where as jetgroove have basically advertised tracks in mp3 format for sale without seeking permission from anyone they should, like distributors, artists, record labels etc etc.... i really dont know how u can try and make a defence/argument for this website when its apparent to everyone and i mean literaly EVERYONE involved that they are being quite ruthless in their actions and basically have no regard for any of the artists they are doing wrong too

surely u can see this???

there is a massive difference between what nuloop and jetgroove do...... massive!

[eyes without a face]

also i must point out mate, the major difference to me is that on nuloop these records have actually been in stock legally and have simply sold out. as far as im aware its the complete discretion as to wether they order more in, if the record has sold out then it must be a good seller and they will usually order more.... maybe nuloop have let things slide a little i dont know, but ul find this happening on most web-based record stores i think!

;)

[The Overfiend]

i say sue them. my lawyer says enjoy the free publicity and set up a liscense with them.


the have done wrong and can be sued. they dont need to have sold units to have performed fraud and mis representation. they are also potentialy breaking criminal laws just not civil.

and i settledown i'll probably go with the advise of my lawyer.
your lawyer is also a cool cat.

[karlo]

its ****ed up, becaouse every boy can download all new stuff and play it over FS for FREE!!!!!!!

THIS MUST BE CLOSED!!!!!!

[eyes without a face]

agreed dude.... agreed

this has caused such a stir in the scene, not seen this many backs up for a long time!

[schlongfingers]

no its not, because nuloop is an online record store that sells records in the legal way i.e deals with distribution companies, everything is above board

...

where as jetgroove have basically advertised tracks in mp3 format for sale without seeking permission from anyone they should, like distributors, artists, record labels etc etc....

I'm not sure that's the 'legal way' is it? It's the established way but I'm not sure doing it a different way is illegal, if anyone can tell me why it is and under what law I'd like to know it. And this falls under Russian law I believe??


i really dont know how u can try and make a defence/argument for this website when its apparent to everyone and i mean literaly EVERYONE involved that they are being quite ruthless in their actions and basically have no regard for any of the artists they are doing wrong too

I'm just saying what I think, and I don't think of it like an 'everyone' i'm afraid, the world is funn of opinions not bleating innit.


there is a massive difference between what nuloop and jetgroove do...... massive!

Nuloop and numerous other online stores advertise items they don't have in stock, allow users to add to a wishlist, they certainly list items that they haven't had in stock for years, in some cases I believe they haven't had them in stock at all. Many stores both online and offline offer a record finding service, this service is just an online equivalent - in many ways it is discogs with sound clips.


its **** up, becaouse every boy can download all new stuff and play it over FS for FREE!!!!!!!

THIS MUST BE CLOSED!!!!!!

Karlo they AREN'T selling full downloads without an agreement with the copyright owner, they are offering short clips, no longer than many clips on Juno and other major online stores - I suggest you open a dialogue and decide whether you want to work with them or not.

[eyes without a face]

dude, seriously, have u even looked at Jetgroove? they have WHOLE EP'S ADVERTISED FOR SALE AT DOWNLOADABLE MP3'S!!!! there are range of single tracks or whole eps advertised there dude, they are nothing like discogs.

come on man check these things out before u comment, seriously!

and of course online record stores such as nuloop are legal, if they werent they would almost definately be shut down soon, as i feel confident jetgroove may be!

you need proof before u can say that u believe certain stores like nuloop have never had certain records in stock, come back with proof of this and il believe u... u only have to go to jetgroove now and u know that from the START they havent had the tracks available, or the tracks they do have are illegal downloads!

joking aside mate, u wanna hand ur spade over now or keep digging?

[eyes without a face]

and by the way, its not opinion dude, what these guys have done is wrong and those who really believe in the scene and their music all stand by this FACT.

i feel so strongly about this and its not even my music involved here, that surely tells u something!

[eyes without a face]

come on peeps i know its late but surely im not alone here? haha

;)

[schlongfingers]

dude, seriously, have u even looked at Jetgroove? they have WHOLE EP'S ADVERTISED FOR SALE AT DOWNLOADABLE MP3'S!!!! there are range of single tracks or whole eps advertised there dude, they are nothing like discogs.

Discogs contains the listings for whole EP's and has affiliate links through to record finding services like Amazon, Gemm and Musicstack - it's similar in concept, although less overtly commercial in its nature.


and of course online record stores such as nuloop are legal, if they werent they would almost definately be shut down soon, as i feel confident jetgroove may be!

I'm not suggesting Nuloop is illegal!! I'm using them as a comparison against Jetgroove in terms of displaying items they don't actually have for sale. Its analagous because they show images, clips and wishlist options for items they don't actually have to sell - it's very similar in its concept.


you need proof before u can say that u believe certain stores like nuloop have never had certain records in stock, come back with proof of this and il believe u... u only have to go to jetgroove now and u know that from the START they havent had the tracks available, or the tracks they do have are illegal downloads!

Fact is the have listings for items that they don't have in stock, and certainly they list records that they could not possibly have had in stock - unless they were running their online store before the advent of the internet - http://www.nuloop.com/Result2_e.php?artistget=&label=dj+international&St yl=all&Titre=&ref=&image.x=0&image.y=0


And by the way, its not opinion dude, what these guys have done is wrong and those who really believe in the scene and their music all stand by this FACT.

Scott, this is OPINION not FACT. Are you suggesting that I must not care about music, and that I dont believe in the music I make, play and enjoy because I don't think Jetgroove is necessarily the devil in disguise? Aw come on.

[Miromiric]

to stickyfingers:
jetgroove is illegal cause of a simple fact they are not trying to sell mp3s of vinyls they PURCHASED (or mp3s how other digitals do normally). instead, they download tunes from soulseek and illegal pirate FTPs specialized in ripping vinyls (which is obvious from how they name their records, if u ever saw a ripped mp3).

[eyes without a face]

dude u questioned Nuloops legality in this comment!

So therefore this is illegal? http://www.nuloop.com/Result2_e.php?artistget=&label=BLACKOUT&Styl=all &Titre=&ref=&image.x=0&image.y=0


i didnt say u claimed they were illegal, i said u questioned their legality, huge difference mate!

Discogs does contain details of eps, records etc etc yes, but it DOES NOT offer those eps, records for sales as downloads from the site, this is the big difference mate. yes it has links to affiliates, but these are links to people who are legally allowed and known to sell music and whatever other products they have on offer (amazon for example with books, dvds etc).... again there is a MASSIVE difference between the 2 sites!

and yes again, nuloop have got listings for records they dont have in stock, but as ive said before, they have simply SOLD OUT OF THESE RECORDS!!!!! that link u posted doesnt prove anything, records like Joe Smooth- Promised land are classics and records like this are often repressed, sometimes on smaller labels, sometimes on compilations etc etc so just because the record was available before the birth of the internet doesnt meant that it cannot be sold legally on the internet! its not a hard concept mate, usually called something loose like "supply and demand"..... come on dude seriously think about it, jesus!

its easy mate, go to any online store and search for elvis records... this guy was dead long before the internet was an apple in tim berners lee's eye and yet u can get all his stuff online easily.... its not a hard concept to get ur head around dude!

and no i wasnt saying u dont love the music u make, play, listen to etc, but u are one seriously deluded guy if u cant even see past the bullshit that Jetgroove have just laid down for every cunt to step in.....

i will argue this out on this board until the cows come home mate, but the fact is u are then only one who cannot see how jetgroove have undermined every artist they have listed up, how they have set out to intentionally screw every artist they have put up and make a quick, cheap buck....

its not the devil in disguise no, but i bet they are related!

;)

[djsirround]

these guys should be assisinated like people who play trance.. e.g. Tiesto.. joking heheh

But for sure this is not a good thing, 1st of all they are uploading tracks which are illegal, 2nd for my opinion we should stay on vinyl.. may be you tell me but listen they help for promotion etc, its true.. but that may be can do it your site by providing clips on your site, don't afford it? don't do it... but sites like jetgroove should be closed.

[eyes without a face]

WORD


this should clear things up a bit more......

www.trackitdown.net

check that, a legitimate mp3 for purchase downloading site, run by professionals, some of the big hitters in the dance scene (not just techno). This is how an mp3 sale site should be run....

Jetgroove my ass!

[inigo kennedy]

a bunch of thoughts from the past few days. i have to be quick as i've got to hit the road...

i've had my material deleted from jetgroove. not because i despise mp3s (i think it's clear that i don't so i don't think here is the place to make that justification), but because i despise the approach to business and it's potential for detrimental effects on the business in general...

i use the word business not to describe something that involves money but something that involves goods, quality control, relationships and distribution.

whilst the media is jumping up and down about launching action against 28 as yet unamed mp3 file sharers in the uk (and it's happened elsewhere too) we're seeing the genesis of what i think is a far more dangerous beast. it prooves yet again how hard and increasingly harder it will be to police the distribution of non physical goods. the law already struggles to cope with rapidly changing concepts that it wasn't put in place to legislate.

as far as jetgroove and their "legal" response is concerned, there is a clear implication that they are in possession of illegal digital copies of copyright material. it makes no difference if they are yet selling or distributing that material although obviously that would take the illegality further.

the mp3s listed of my material and most others i checked were marked as sourced from vinyl. that to me indicates that they are not sourced from the label as they would be without doubt sourced from the masters. it indicates they are actually in possession of or have access to the material. it will result in further propagating inferior quality material. i'm also concerned that it is highly damaging to existing relationships between labels and chosen legitimate businesses.

i think jetgroove is bringing to attention a much wider problem.

there's masses and masses to discuss about the benefits of digital distribution and the future of music in general but that shouldn't be confused with a discussion about dubious business practices and illegality (or the application of loopholes in a struggling international legal system).

i have to say i find it disappointing to find even free material such as my asymmetric|mp3 project appearing on soulseek, etc. it stinks of greed. what is the point...

plenty more i'd like to write but i've got to go, cheers,

inigo

www.inigokennedy.com
www.asymmetric.co.uk

[eyes without a face]

some wikid points there inigo, and i think its good that someone as involved in the business as yourself has come on and put forward their comments!

im sure that if anyone tried to sue or take legal action against jetgroove wud find themselves in a complicated legal battle, as there are certains things that would be taken into account such as where they got the mp3's, did they buy the source records etc etc but basically, they are breaking the law they need to be stopped.

u have ur own mp3 based label so you've shown ur willingness to embrace the future formats that are developing and using them wisely, but i think everyone, well NEARLY everyone, agrees that these guys just have no regard for the artists, labels, companies that they are trying to make a buck out of.

a very messy affair is this one i think, and i can see it running on for a while!

[schlongfingers]

Scott, I wasn't questioning the legality of Nuloop, it was a rhetorical question.

I really don't have time to sit here on a sunny Sunday arguing the toss about whether or not development is a good thing. But some might find the following news item on Jetgroove interesting, and may even want to follow the information in the last paragraph. Simple solution.


Tuesday this week October 5th JetGroove the biggest on-line underground music provider has launched its website. On the website it offers alternative music downloads in mp3 format made by independent record labels and artists.

During first three days JetGroove received an enormous amount of attention from users, record labels, artists, authors and publishers. And this attention brought some contradictions to the light of music community. The music community was disappointed at some parts of our website and made some wrong assumptions. We wanted to clear up all misunderstandings that arose so we want to explain our position how our website is organized and business is led.

JetGroove is the unique project that we created to give the worldwide exposure to independent record labels and artists, producing alternative music. The way our website organized is:

First part of the website - music, that is represented by record labels who already signed contracts with JetGroove. These tracks are available to be purchased and downloaded.
Second part of the website - information about music that is placed on the website for promotion of independent record labels and artists. These "tracks" could not be purchased or downloaded. However they could be put ON HOLD. As soon as this happens, record label or artist to whom this track belongs is contacted with the offer of doing business with JetGroove. This greatly increases the exposure for many of the record labels.

The line that JetGroove is going to continue to follow is: LEGAL SALES ONLY. The project was created to give independents a good chance of being known in the world, and earning money, not to make them suffer again as they do from p2p systems. And the least thing JetGroove planned to do is to violate rights of record labels, publishers, artists or authors. JetGroove officially states that if you are not interested to have your tracks on www.jetgroove.com, you should contact JetGroove immediately and all the information we have about your tracks will be taken off the website ASAP.

[eyes without a face]

yes thats very true, i read that statement before on jetgroove but also check this out

Second part of the website - information about music that is placed on the website for promotion of independent record labels and artists. These "tracks" could not be purchased or downloaded. However they could be put ON HOLD. As soon as this happens, record label or artist to whom this track belongs is contacted with the offer of doing business with JetGroove. This greatly increases the exposure for many of the record labels.

anyone with even a tad of respect for the artists they are trying to sell should know that this is not the way to do business!!!

its just me setting up an mp3 site with pop bands stuff, then listing everyone from Abba to Westlife, offering their music for sale, then going "oh actually, i forgot to get in touch with them to ask if it was ok to sell their stuff, i best do it now when they are extremely pissed off because ive been advertising their music for sale illegally"

if you dont have the time to argue the toss then why are u? im starting to think youve got a vested interest in jetgroove mate!

development is a good think yes, www.trackitdown.net, theres a good example of development that i posted earlier, check it out mate and see the difference

there is a big difference between development and scheming

[djsirround]

I think we are streching this thing a lot, listen people, in Malta we have a problem, and this is that the people argue but they don't actions, and I think here is happening the same.

I mean, ok, you are sending e-mail to the bulgarian or whatever his surname is, I don't care, he can be from Mars from me, is there anyone outthere who is ready to sue him?

If we don't stop these people they will continue to do these things. There are no central authority or geverning body running the internet, that results to less control of the web domains, I think when some one will buy a web-domain have to give specifications what he/she will upload on the site, and in cases like this have to show legal statements infront.

Come one, we are in 2004!

[gustavo]

did anyone asked for jetgroove to remove theyr stuff from the site??

what happened??

legal actions in russia?? u must be joking or are very naive


if they r really (and it seems so)doing illegal stuff theres only one way

starts with an H and finishs with a K everything else (leagal attourneys is pure fantasy in acountry dominated by corruption)

also ive heard in slovenia and many other places around this happens ...

sad...

people must do something...(and the only thing to do is this cases is answer in the same way...i hope understand...)

[S E]

I asked them to remove the Goathead releases, since I dont think I will ever work with them after the way that they acted.

But the releases are still up there... Have sent some more emails today, so lets see what happens

[Internal Error Records]

i say sue them. my lawyer says enjoy the free publicity and set up a liscense with them.


the have done wrong and can be sued. they dont need to have sold units to have performed fraud and mis representation. they are also potentialy breaking criminal laws just not civil.

and i settledown i'll probably go with the advise of my lawyer.
your lawyer is also a cool cat.


he has is moments. he actually got me listening to acid techno back a few years ago when we went to an acid party in montreal and introduced me to DDr, Roland the Bastard, Chris libeator and others in a bar near the party.

btw it was good to meet you SummerofSam outside of hardnoise.

[schlongfingers]

yes thats very true, i read that statement before on jetgroove but also check this out

Second part of the website - information about music that is placed on the website for promotion of independent record labels and artists. These "tracks" could not be purchased or downloaded. However they could be put ON HOLD. As soon as this happens, record label or artist to whom this track belongs is contacted with the offer of doing business with JetGroove. This greatly increases the exposure for many of the record labels.

anyone with even a tad of respect for the artists they are trying to sell should know that this is not the way to do business!!!

I think this is where we differ, I don't believe in the established way of doing business, or in the 'rules' - at the end of the day I see it as evolution.


if you dont have the time to argue the toss then why are u? im starting to think youve got a vested interest in jetgroove mate!

I don't.


@S E - Please can you let us know if you have any problems or delays in getting your music removed from Jetgroove - they have made a promise in that respect, and if they don't stand by that then I would say they are being dodge.

[S E]

Goathead 002 is down, but GH001 is still up there.

[eyes without a face]

I think this is where we differ, I don't believe in the established way of doing business, or in the 'rules' - at the end of the day I see it as evolution

u got a might strange idea of evolution dude, evolution is something that helps us to move forward and develop, and these guys arent helping anyone to do that at all

[schlongfingers]

u got a might strange idea of evolution dude, evolution is something that helps us to move forward and develop, and these guys arent helping anyone to do that at all

No, evolution is a natural process.. technically what Jetgroove is doing is possible, therefore it's happened - if it hadn't have been Jetgroove it would have been someone else.

[eyes without a face]

it doesnt matter whose doing it dude, its what they have done thats the problem

[eyes without a face]

and developing and moving forward is a natural process dude, thanks for backing up my own point ;)

[schlongfingers]

Jesus Christ. OK, I bow down to you scott you've clearly got me there.

[eyes without a face]

its got nothing to do with Jesus mate ;)

[Miromiric]

evolution doesnt necesarilly means moving forward for one specie. look at the whales, they r so pathetic they r gonna vanish soon!

[dirty_bass]

look at the whales, they r so pathetic they r gonna vanish soon!
:doh:
erm, yeah, look at the rainforests, they could do with evolving to, about time they grew steal trunks to deter them being cut down :eh: :?:

[Miromiric]

yeah exactly my point.

[bornaa]

yea looks like evolution really aint goin well for whales, trees and artists that dont want jetgroove kinda buisness :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry:


altho i dont get u ppl...if they sell even 1 of yer recs (even in this way) its still a good thing for you and the scene, rite? altho i aint really sure who'd wanna buy records like this.....it sure does sound fishy

[The Divide]

look at the whales, they r so pathetic they r gonna vanish soon!
:doh:
erm, yeah, look at the rainforests, they could do with evolving to, about time they grew steal trunks to deter them being cut down :eh: :?:

HAHAHAHAHAHA

[Adverse]

evolution doesnt necesarilly means moving forward for one specie. look at the whales, they r so pathetic they r gonna vanish soon!

lol.

what in the ****. pathetic my ass.. look at the hrvatski's. what are they still doing here anyways? <3

[The Divide]

evolution doesnt necesarilly means moving forward for one specie. look at the whales, they r so pathetic they r gonna vanish soon!

lol.

what in the ****. pathetic my ass.. look at the hrvatski's. what are they still doing here anyways? <3

Hahahahaha

[Miromiric]

hey wait till the world starts nukin itself! who d **** will ever nuke croatia? NOONE, we ll survive, ergo we r uber.

[The Divide]

hey wait till the world starts nukin itself! who d **** will ever nuke croatia? NOONE, we ll survive, ergo we r uber.

LoL if the nukes were dropped the whales would probably survive. The ultimate irony :lol:

Back on topic...

Aren’t copywrite laws international? If so then how come we are debating its legality? I mean as far as I know they broke the law when they advertised tracks which have been copied from another format. That can be Mp3, ripping from vinyl, cd , etc.

And the proof of that is in the fact that they have unofficial music on the site (butties). Also to advertise such music is false advertising? Not because they don’t have it in stock but because the item is not for sale!

So basically we have a group of people who are selling music that’s not even released (in some cases) which has been copied from another format without asking both the labels and the artist. That to me is so blatantly disrespectful and there’s no ‘if’s’ or ‘but’s’ about it

I think it’s in the best interests of everyone that people don’t support this site. As a matter of principal not for what it stands for but for how it was done. You encourage this kind of practice and you’ll end up with loads of sites like this. Who’s to say they are going to be straight with you? I mean they already crossed the line when they broke the law and have already shown no respect for anyone involved in putting this music out.

Someone should setup another site like it and then actually ask for the permission before advertising the shit. Not everyone want there music to be sold on mp3

My 2 cents

[Adverse]

Someone should setup another site like it and then actually ask for the permission before advertising the shit. Not everyone want there music to be sold on mp3

My 2 cents


this why i am upset. well said boss.

[schlongfingers]

hey wait till the world starts nukin itself! who d **** will ever nuke croatia? NOONE, we ll survive, ergo we r uber.Aren’t copywrite laws international? If so then how come we are debating its legality? I mean as far as I know they broke the law when they advertised tracks which have been copied from another format. That can be Mp3, ripping from vinyl, cd , etc.

I don't think that copyright laws ARE international - that's really the crux of the argument - http://www.theregister.co.uk/2004/05/05/russian_mp3_site/


Someone should setup another site like it and then actually ask for the permission before advertising the shit. Not everyone want there music to be sold on mp3

Loads of companies already have.