Q: Are there too many new labels starting up?

[Si the Sigh]

Is there really any need for so many new labels and / or sub-labels?

What do you think?

:?:

[G-whizz]

Is there really any need for so many new labels and / or sub-labels?

What do you think?

:?:

I did vote no but as I said in the other thread it doesn`t bother me too much because if I like a tune i`ll buy regardless of what label its on... but I can see how it would be annoying to people who collect whole labels !

[G-whizz]

Is there really any need for so many new labels and / or sub-labels?

What do you think?

:?:

May be the whole sub labels thing stems from us liking to put things into neat little boxes ?

[fatcollective]

im not too sure... yes there are loads of labels starting but "are they all good?" i still find myself searching the record shops (online and offline) for decent music, and there are loads of labels out there but i find not all of them float my boat. At the end of the day if someone starts a new label good on them, but it had better be good because theres a lot of competition out there ! ;)

[Si the Sigh]

I just don't see the point. Put it like this...

DJ / Producer 'X' starts up a new label, 'X' Records. The first lot of releases are wicked, really solid acid techno / techno. Things are going well. A few months on DJ / Producer 'X' starts another label thats pretty much the same quality tunes, but on a sub label 'Y' Records.

And this 'Y' Records being the one that makes me think WHY? :?:

Why not carry on with 'X' Records? Keep the quality releases coming out on that label. Is there really any need for another label when the styles on 'X' & 'Y' Records are pretty much sounding the same?

I personally, don't think so... :neutral:

[fatcollective]

I see your point there Si, yeah i dont think theres any point having 2 or 3 labels of very simular music styles...maybe thats just being greedy! my point is though that becsue there are so many labels starting, the music will have to be good otherwise sales will be low and the label will stop...therefore the labels with decent music will stay and usually those are the ones that have had real effort put in!

[acidsaturation]

I see where you're coming from there -But I think where sub labels have a place is say you have X label going, but have some quality tunes that are a bit different, but you still want to keep X label as having a strong identity. Then I don't see to much problem starting Y label - you then have the reputation of your first label to stand on, but a different style or identity for the second one.

With lots of new labels starting up, I guess it makes it harder (or more time consuming) to search out the best tunes. But then If there's only a few labels everyone has the same tunes and that gets boring. I don't mean that in a kind of elitist "I have this tune 'cos I know this label" kind of way, but there can never be too much good techno, and a bit of variety is nice!!

[Si the Sigh]

Wow! I'm personally quite surprised at the poll results so far...

[Scott Kemix]

Most of the stuff released, i probably only really like half the stuff that is out. I think people are just puttin stuff out for the sake of it to be honest, as i can now appreciate how much time and effort is input into each track, you can tell a mile away

[Si the Sigh]

100% agree with you there. :clap:

[fatcollective]

Most of the stuff released, i probably only really like half the stuff that is out. I think people are just puttin stuff out for the sake of it to be honest, as i can now appreciate how much time and effort is input into each track, you can tell a mile away

exactly my point mate, the good labels, well produced are the ones that will stay.....with so much competition these days, the labels you can tell that have had no effort put in will die and the ones with real effort and passion will stay :lol:

[Scott Kemix]

;)

[Si the Sigh]

Well said! :clap:

Balloonheads anyone? 2 releases + died.
FU2 anyone? 2 releases + died.
CID anyone? 1 release + died.

What was the point in starting those labels up? Ok, so an old example, but like you said "the good labels, well produced are the ones that will stay"

[Scott Kemix]

Good examples, but i reckon this is how it will always go, as these artists can always come back and startup these labels whenever they feel the need

[Si the Sigh]

Good examples, but i reckon this is how it will always go, as these artists can always come back and startup these labels whenever they feel the need

What? Like Sterling Moss did when Raceway stopped & Racetraxx started... :?:

If Mark Tyler comes back to the scene, is he going to continue No Entry & Re Entry, or is he going to start up Rear Entry Records or something?

:crackup:

[dan the acid man]

i voted yes, it would be nice to see a more varied list of artists releasing on established labels in my opnion, but i do admit, alot of the new labels look like they are going to be good quality, so i wish everybody involved the success they deserve, thats if the quality is maintained at the same standard :cool:

[fatcollective]

i voted yes, it would be nice to see a more varied list of artists releasing on established labels in my opnion, but i do admit, alot of the new labels look like they are going to be good quality, so i wish everybody involved the success they deserve, thats if the quality is maintained at the same standard :cool:

well said dan ;)

[Si the Sigh]

Good examples, but i reckon this is how it will always go, as these artists can always come back and startup these labels whenever they feel the need

What? Like Sterling Moss did when Raceway stopped & Racetraxx started... :?:

If Mark Tyler comes back to the scene, is he going to continue No Entry & Re Entry, or is he going to start up Rear Entry Records or something?

:crackup:

...by the way I do hope Mr Tyler does come back to the scene!

[mr burns]

the people who have a bottomless budget for there label can still only release at the most 12 releases a year, (one a month), so producers who write loads of tunes obviously need other outlets for there productions, so 2 labels + a bottomless budget = 24 releases a year, probably not the best example but do you see what im saying?

[Si the Sigh]

Yea, I see what your saying...

BUT...

If DJ / producer 'X' has this bottomless budget, tunes lined up & loads of productions, why not put out more than 2 a month on their established 'X' Records label? Why start another?

I'd rather buy say 2 'X' records in a month knowing they are going to be shit hot, instead of trying to get hold of yet another new label...

[Scott Kemix]

yea man, mark tyler. Thought his No Entry was a wicked label, heard rumours that he is not up for it?????

[Si the Sigh]

I'd heard that as well. Someone said he had gone back to his old job...

[Scott Kemix]

gutted, my friend a.p, went down to london last week and heard this news..............o well more room for more labels then>?

[Si the Sigh]

:lol:

[Scott Kemix]

;)

[mr burns]

[quote="
If DJ / producer 'X' has this bottomless budget, tunes lined up & loads of productions, why not put out more than 2 a month on their established 'X' Records label? Why start another?

..[/quote]

because it will affect sales of the established label

[AcidTrash]

Can't think of any example of that happening.

[dirty_bass]

Well, I don`t think the dwindling market can support the influx of new labels.
There is no quality control anymore, anyone with a bit of cash can make 300-500 records, and distributers will distribute it, because they don`t lose out whether it sells or not, it`s just extra readies to them.
Especially now that the market has crashed, there are more labels where it`s someone who is happy to just release 300 badly pressed whatever of their own stuff.
I`m not knocking anyone starting a new label, but really, send out some demo`s to other labels, if nobody bites, then it`s possible that your shit isn`t good enough. Think about that. Not everyone can make good music.
I understand that some people might just be sooo out there and ahead of their game, that they are making next level shit, that is just not understood, and so, it needs it`s own label. but for the most part, it`s just more bangin 909 based techno.
Loads of kids these days, send out one demo, get no interest, and think "bah, they just don`t understand, I`ll start my own label"

So it`s a tough argument really.

It`s especially annoying to see established names bringing out new sub labels, and just releasing the same shit.
I mean, there is nothing wrong with having a few labels, but at least have them noticably different.
Some sub labels are releasing music of a sub sub sub sub compartamentalised genre of a sub genre.
Like "well our first label is techno, but our sub label is funky techno, and our new sub sub label is funky, jacking, punky techno"
I mean c`mon, what is the ultimate extrapolation of this scenario.

A label for kick drums
one for high hats
one for bass lines.
........

[speed-it-up]

I think there should definately be more labels.
I know a guy who is supremely talented but got knocked back by Steve Smitten because his style was "too old style acid".
He started his own label, got the devilfish modification - most releases sold right out.

Plus for dj's breaking through, its good if there's always new labels coming out. If you know your stuff you can be playing tracks nobody else has. EVERYONE buys Routemaster, Cluster etc. Some djs get promos well in advance. How are you going to stand out with your own style if there's only a handful of labels churning out releases?

[Scott Kemix]

:clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap:

[dirty_bass]

EVERYONE buys Routemaster, Cluster etc. Some djs get promos well in advance. How are you going to stand out with your own style if there's only a handful of labels churning out releases?
Ah, well if where talking about in an acid techno context, then it`s different, because there aren`t that many acid tech labels out there, so a few more wouldn`t hurt. In a techno context, there are loads of labels, so really I don`t think we need more labels, just better distribution of all the good ones out there.

I`ve thought long and hard about this subject. My own production interests are becoming pslit now. I have the techno that I make, the 4x4, dancefloor stuff, both the hard and dark through to the more commercial
clubby trax, going out on my label. but I also spend a lot of time making more experimental and cutting edge electronica. I can`t really put this on my techno label, so the first thing I thought was, ok, I`ll start another label.
then I did what very few people do. I looked into it. Found out about the amount of labels, how sales are etc. And I`ve come to the conclusion that, there are enough labels out there, and I don`t need to start another label. If my experimental stuff is good enough, then it should go on some of the better labels out there. So I`m currently sending out demo`s and am now garnering releases.
So there is an alternative way of getting your shit out there.

[xfive]

A label for kick drums
one for high hats
one for bass lines.
........

Shit man I'm gonna need like 3 more turntables and a 6 channel mixer :lol:

[dirty_bass]

nah mate, just get a laptop and ableton
haha

[jonnyspeed]

I say no. simply because a label is just a theme by different artist(s).

RAW vs. Top Shelf
SUF vs. Cluster
Kiddaz vs. Killaz
Hydraulix vs. Apex
Mosquito vs. Rise Robots Rise
Shark vs. PGV
MaxMin vs. WahWah
Skankelic vs. ...

then theres a whole load of individual specialist labels that do lots of artists:

Tresor, Warp, DJax, Drop Bass Network, Expressillion 4x4, er... Fresh Grind, Holzplatten (er... shit, acid techno?) - well you get my drift.

The all provide you with some guidance - even better when they drop an artist in you've never heard before - the start of a journey, skating into new tunes and appriciation of wider themes within techno.

anyway - it also allows artists to work out what sells and what doesn't. Labels are brands - something punters love.

[MangaFish]

Is there really any need for so many new labels and / or sub-labels?

What do you think?

:?:

I did vote no but as I said in the other thread it doesn`t bother me too much because if I like a tune i`ll buy regardless of what label its on... but I can see how it would be annoying to people who collect whole labels !

i dont think its about collecting labels. i have a core few labels i always check out when i'm record shopping as i know they are consistantly good. this doesnt meen i buy every release, just that it stands a great chance of being the sound that i play. i dont have the time (or the patience) to trall though hundreds of records as i dont just buy acid techno so i'm always missing out on classic tunes as they are on labels i havent even heard of :doh:

[The Germ]

i dont know i think there needs to be better releases on these labels coming out they are good and diverse but they sound like they been whipped up in a day. I understand money needs to be made to pay the bills. When Chris Liberator was here we talked about, all these new labels starting and he said striaght up we need to pay the bills.


I CANT AFFORD THIS SHIT! :clap:

[Si the Sigh]

I know a guy who is supremely talented but got knocked back by Steve Smitten because his style was "too old style acid".
He started his own label, got the devilfish modification - most releases sold right out.

Out of interest, who would that be? :?:

[Rog]

i couldn't care - it just means you have to hunt a little harder for what you want , better than limited choice eh!!! :cool:

[Si the Sigh]

[quote="
If DJ / producer 'X' has this bottomless budget, tunes lined up & loads of productions, why not put out more than 2 a month on their established 'X' Records label? Why start another?

..

because it will affect sales of the established label[/quote]

I don't see how TBH...

[speed-it-up]

I know a guy who is supremely talented but got knocked back by Steve Smitten because his style was "too old style acid".
He started his own label, got the devilfish modification - most releases sold right out.

Out of interest, who would that be? :?:

He goes under the name of A1X - Sidewalk Theory Records. Went under with Infectious :cry:

[Si the Sigh]

Ah! So its either Andrew or Jodie you know then. Shame Sidewalk Theory went under. I liked the style of the releases, although I will say some of the pressings were fu*king piss poor. Great label design though! :clap:

[mr burns]

..[/quote]

because it will affect sales of the established label[/quote]

I don't see how TBH...[/quote]

because people start to miss loads of releases if they come out every two weeks it doesnt give enough time for the records to sell say 4 example you have 700 pressed only 300 of them will sell when it first comes out the other 400 will sell over the months to come now if theres a new release out straight after them first 300 are sold the shops arent gona b back ordering the rest of that release they are going to be stocking there shelves with the new release leaving over 400 un sold records , i cant speak 4 anyone else because i dont know, but my records are distributed through jedi and the closet they will release stuff is every month now surely there must b a reason 4 this when obviously the more records they sell the more money they make!

[speed-it-up]

Ah! So its either Andrew or Jodie you know then. Shame Sidewalk Theory went under. I liked the style of the releases, although I will say some of the pressings were fu*king piss poor. Great label design though! :clap:

Yeah, but I've got compressed versions on final scratch now...

Sidewalk Theory had the right idea - plenty on dark 303 lines and a healthy respect for Stella!

I know both Andrew and Jodie from the Tribe of Munt parties when they actually dj'd a bit. If you speak to them, tell them Ed told them to get the slippers off and start attending a few parties!

[ollie303]

if your a musician and you want to get your music out there on vinyl in the shops and played out on big rigs/clubs the only real way is to start your own lable, ive given up on sending demos out and pushing it,as it doesnt seem to get you anywhere .every major release is sown up by 10producers! (sorry guys haha) which has left me with a more relaxed atitude towards it all. just to take time and not worry about it all its just fun. but id like to see some new faces some new djs and more new lables
and some new good music from new producers on the highly aclaimed acid techno stable.

[networkacid]

I'm LOVING all of the newer Acid/London tehcno labels. So much good new stuff, lots more variety. I'm glad the sound is not so dominated by the SUF crew/labels (still love their work but it's good to be able to contrast it with other producers/labels music)

[loopdon]

Well, I don`t think the dwindling market can support the influx of new labels.
There is no quality control anymore, anyone with a bit of cash can make 300-500 records, and distributers will distribute it, because they don`t lose out whether it sells or not, it`s just extra readies to them.
Especially now that the market has crashed, there are more labels where it`s someone who is happy to just release 300 badly pressed whatever of their own stuff.
I`m not knocking anyone starting a new label, but really, send out some demo`s to other labels, if nobody bites, then it`s possible that your shit isn`t good enough. Think about that. Not everyone can make good music.
I understand that some people might just be sooo out there and ahead of their game, that they are making next level shit, that is just not understood, and so, it needs it`s own label. but for the most part, it`s just more bangin 909 based techno.
Loads of kids these days, send out one demo, get no interest, and think "bah, they just don`t understand, I`ll start my own label"

So it`s a tough argument really.

It`s especially annoying to see established names bringing out new sub labels, and just releasing the same shit.
I mean, there is nothing wrong with having a few labels, but at least have them noticably different.
Some sub labels are releasing music of a sub sub sub sub compartamentalised genre of a sub genre.
Like "well our first label is techno, but our sub label is funky techno, and our new sub sub label is funky, jacking, punky techno"
I mean c`mon, what is the ultimate extrapolation of this scenario.

A label for kick drums
one for high hats
one for bass lines.
........


true.

[grumblemunta]

hahahahaha.

on august 25th, you said....


Yea. I remember the label, more so for the Stella style logo than anything else though. The tracks were a little weak IMO.

but on november 12th, you said....


Ah! So its either Andrew or Jodie you know then. Shame Sidewalk Theory went under. I liked the style of the releases

either you like contradicting yourself, or you change you mind pretty quick. :lol:

anyway, i couldnt disagree with dirtybass more (as usual :lol: ). if you are an acid producer, i would advise you not to even bother sending sending out demo tapes to labels. the economics of releasing small runs of hard techno is so brutal, and the return so small, that unless you are well known name, nobody will take the risk of releasing one of your tunes.

as others have said, if you are an unknown, the only way to get your music out there is to press it up yourself. the sidewalk theory boys were doing amazing tunes for years, and sending off demos left, right and centre. they got the message after being pissed around for ages, and got the money together to make their own releases. needless to say, they sold like hotcakes, despite being very poor quality presses.

[Si the Sigh]

Sorry Mr Munter... :lol: :doh:

What I ment was I liked the style of the Sidewalk Theory releases, but the sound quality & pressings were very weak. :oops: