All music has come to an end

[crime]

Noticed this in the production forum:


Music has changed
It`s more of a throwaway thing than it has ever been.
There`s nothing left to rebel against, and it never makes a difference anyway, as people know.
There will be cool music, and new music, but I boubt there will ever be another music revolution.
I hope their is, but I`m willing to place 50 quid at a bookies to bet that there will be no music revolutions within the next 10 years.

I've been feeling like this a bit recently, like we're living in the most disposable time ever, we've had the disposable razor, disposable nappies, even the disposable toothbrush. Now we're onto disposable media, particuarly nowdays film and music. Cristian Vogel named his penultimate Tresor album "All music has come to an end", do you think he had already seen it on the horizon?

Maybe I'm just getting older and less naive to the ways of the world..

I want the edge and grit and excitement back

discuss....

[dirty_bass]

Well, if you consider the times we are living in, we have more to stand up and shout "bollox" to than for a long time.
But people just seem to have rolled over and let it wash over them.
New Punk bands aren`t saying anything anymore, they are just image.
There are no spitting, shagging, phuck you all, smash it all up, kill your idols, drunken drug crazed rock n roll stars any more.
It`s all been sanitised.
The only thing we have now, to replace the true anit everything rock star is people like 50 cent
A pimp and gangster who has been shot 9 times, made a lot of money and sold out as soon as the dollars were flashed in front of him.
Not really a rebel against the system.
But a product of the system.

What we need is some good, old fashioned anarchy and rebellion, with a bit of intelligence.
Something with a message above
"sell drugs, make money, kill people, take their money, shag birds, make money, make money, make money, get shot, make money"

Dance music is a little faceless, and lacks any identifiable message.
Most of us are oldies (comparitavely) in this scene, and the kids need a message they can chant and get angry about and agree with.
Dance music isn`t really providing that buzz.

[crime]

The only thing we have now, to replace the true anit everything rock star is people like 50 cent
A pimp and gangster who has been shot 9 times, made a lot of money and sold out as soon as the dollars were flashed in front of him.
Not really a rebel against the system.
But a product of the system.

well, this is it, it's like the slave trade never ended, y'know, if your Young black and american and very lucky, you can rap, have a hummer and be on Cribs too, but at the end of the day it's the big fat white man at the top (i.e. the ceo of whatever major label) who makes the real money...

[Will]

Sounds like a Viper XXL tune! You know what they say, if you want something done you have to do it yourself...

[Will]

Sounds like a Viper XXL tune! You know what they say, if you want something done you have to do it yourself...

[crime]

Well, if you consider the times we are living in, we have more to stand up and shout "bollox" to than for a long time.
But people just seem to have rolled over and let it wash over them.
This is the other problem, there's just too many things to shout about, where do you start? when I was younger it was just fighting for the right to party, travel, live how you want to etc, unfortunately multinational companies and corrupt western regimes have turned the vice so tight that just living is enough of a struggle..

[crime]

Sounds like a Viper XXL tune! You know what they say, if you want something done you have to do it yourself...

???

[Will]

"sell drugs, make money, kill people, take their money, shag birds, make money, make money, make money, get shot, make money"

I meant that sounds like a Viper XXL tune.

[Craig McW]

Unfortunately people today, especially the younger generations, aren't marketing savvy. Victims of advertising, the lot of 'em. Plus, they aren't denied anything, so they have nothing to yearn for. Global communications have made the world smaller, so we know what the next big thing is before it happens, making it unexciting or new. We don't discover anything anymore.... it's given to us in a nice little package with a price tag.

When art becomes a commodity, what's left to admire? When you can have whatever you want, what's left to be passionate about?

[Internal Error Records]

jebus...

what the **** is it with the constant apocolyptic fear that techno and its mediums is gonna get stripped away from everybody.

everybody needs to loosen up, get ****ed up and have a good time.

techno aint dying.

i dont see junglists with a fear that their genre is going away.

[dirty_bass]

jebus...

what the **** is it with the constant apocolyptic fear that techno and its mediums is gonna get stripped away from everybody.

everybody needs to loosen up, get **** up and have a good time.

techno aint dying.

i dont see junglists with a fear that their genre is going away.
Who said anything about techno?
There`s more to life than it alone you know.

[rounser]

Unfortunately people today, especially the younger generations, aren't marketing savvy.
I think Socrates or Plato or someone was complaining about the younger generations lacking values or respect or whatever...not to say you're doing that, but you have to be wary of making such statements about "kids these days" nonetheless. I think that kids these days are more bulletproof to media bollocks than any generation before them, simply because they get bombarded by more of it from a younger age. Or perhaps your point stands because they're getting bombarded with so much marketing from such a young age...?

And as I replied in the production thread, this line:

I boubt there will ever be another music revolution.
...smacks of making the same mistake the head of the patent office in around 1900 made, by claiming that the patent office should be shut down because "everything that could be invented, had been invented." Did anyone predict acid house taking off? I recall the hip hop pioneers being convinced that rap specifically and hip hop in general was just a passing fad, and that it would die out very soon. Who would have predicted that revolution? Or country music taking off for that matter?

[GothamGrooves.com]

Umm for One I think there is plenty to rebel about, now more than ever! The following is from an american stand point..
The problem with with all this technology and communication is that, people are constantly being bombarded with info and we all have to filter a lot of shit out. The result is the masses not giving a shit about what happens in other countries, or about music, or politics etc... They only care about whats being thrown at them. "I read a quote once that said the revolution will be televised" which means many people have become zombies, drones in our society, working their asses of making decent money only to buy a car and spend it on useless wank. This is why we are considered "underground" not because its the cool thing to do, but because we see there is a lot of Bull Shit outside.
Will there be a music revolution? Probably not since its "hip" to be a "punk". But hopefully as technology pushes forward enough kids might say hey, soem of this shit is cool what else is out there? I hate to repeat myself again but it all comes down to exposure, and that exposure is through the media..

[GothamGrooves.com]

[quote]\ I think that kids these days are more bulletproof to media bollocks than any generation before them, simply because they get bombarded by more of it from a younger age.


Quite the opposite, I think thee is soo much they cant see behind it.
So what you have is a pick n choose, do I want coke or pepsi?
ITS the same posion!!

[OriginalTechnobastard]

Well, if you consider the times we are living in, we have more to stand up and shout "bollox" to than for a long time.
But people just seem to have rolled over and let it wash over them.
New Punk bands aren`t saying anything anymore, they are just image.
There are no spitting, shagging, phuck you all, smash it all up, kill your idols, drunken drug crazed rock n roll stars any more.
It`s all been sanitised.
The only thing we have now, to replace the true anit everything rock star is people like 50 cent
A pimp and gangster who has been shot 9 times, made a lot of money and sold out as soon as the dollars were flashed in front of him.
Not really a rebel against the system.
But a product of the system.

What we need is some good, old fashioned anarchy and rebellion, with a bit of intelligence.
Something with a message above
"sell drugs, make money, kill people, take their money, shag birds, make money, make money, make money, get shot, make money"

Dance music is a little faceless, and lacks any identifiable message.
Most of us are oldies (comparitavely) in this scene, and the kids need a message they can chant and get angry about and agree with.
Dance music isn`t really providing that buzz.

Techno is faceless, thats why its a rebel music. Against normal way of things like :clap:

[eyes without a face]

why does change have to be brough on by rebellion? we live in a world were rebellion isnt a new thing and doesnt turn heads like it used to, and as people have stated there's not much left to rebel against, even if u wanted to... which i must say i dont, its not in my nature and id rather take the silent approach and just keep on doing what im doing.... i must say the scaremongering on this site has hit an all time high and i think Joseph used techno as his example because that seems to be the proirity genre here and in these discussions, and i think its safe to say that everyone knows (well those who arent naive enough to admit it) that things are bad at the moment but the only thing it seems people can do at the moment is literaly just keep on writing their music and pushing it, and getting it out there to the labels/people... or at least trying to....

dressing the product up in rebellion with swearing or anti-establishment behaviour or whatever form that rebellion comes in doesnt influence me at all in my honest opinion, and it never did.... for an example i liked some of the Sex Pistols music but ive always hated that whole "we'l do what we want, cos were punks" attitude, which obviously doesnt really apply much these days as id bet my bottom dollar there are not many "real" punk bands left, but im sure some people still adopt this attitude in places and im not sure why i must say.... the one that really gets me are the "goths".... jesus.... this is were image comes over the music for me and thats a bad thing

i am getting a bit tired of all these negative posts about music/techno but this was one that interested me i must say

[eyes without a face]

and techno definatley isnt faceless or a rebel music anymore, with people like Natus and Arkus getting into the German chart's and the fact u can hear techno on radio 1 a few nights a week......

its got a face, just wether or not the face fits with u is a different matter...

[gumpy green]

What we need is some good, old fashioned anarchy and rebellion, with a bit of intelligence.
Something with a message above
"sell drugs, make money, kill people, take their money, shag birds, make money, make money, make money, get shot, make money"

you want kool keith ;)

[rounser]

Hehe, rebellion... :lol:

Puts me in mind of an interview with Bob Geldof where he's talking about how all the young rockers were angry young man types, rebelling against conformity and society....but he pointed out that the thing they were all really rebelling against and which was causing all that angst was not being let into girls. ;)

Where does that leave male-dominated techno genres? Authentic or stoopid? :lol: :doh: What are the girls listening to anyway, if it's not techno or dnb (another sausagefest)....funky house? :crackup:

[soma]

What we need is some good, old fashioned anarchy and rebellion, with a bit of intelligence.


I reckon those squat/warehouse party boys [however messed up that who scene is] are still putting a big V at the authorities and saying bollox to you all. Those have gotta be some of the most rebellious and anarchich situations i've ever been in. sheesh. but at the same time the best parties i've ever been to as well.

The punks of dance music. I was talking to a friends uncle the other day about it all and he said after punk had died away and dance music flourished the natrual progression for him and his friends was techno and throwing these warehouse parties. They're still going now. The old codgers.

;)

I know the parties are rife with dirty drugs and crack heads and i don't go because of this anymore [except maybe new year] i've still got a lot of respect for what they're trying to do out there.

[soma]

What we need is some good, old fashioned anarchy and rebellion, with a bit of intelligence.


I reckon those squat/warehouse party boys [however messed up that who scene is] are still putting a big V at the authorities and saying bollox to you all. Those have gotta be some of the most rebellious and anarchich situations i've ever been in. sheesh. but at the same time the best parties i've ever been to as well.

The punks of dance music. I was talking to a friends uncle the other day about it all and he said after punk had died away and dance music flourished the natrual progression for him and his friends was techno and throwing these warehouse parties. They're still going now. The old codgers.

;)

I know the parties are rife with dirty drugs and crack heads and i don't go because of this anymore [except maybe new year] i've still got a lot of respect for what they're trying to do out there.

[soma]

whoops sorry double post. my browser's a bit f*cked at the moment..

[GothamGrooves.com]

Where does that leave male-dominated techno genres? Authentic or stoopid? :lol: :doh: What are the girls listening to anyway, if it's not techno or dnb (another sausagefest)....funky house? :crackup:

In America they mainly listen to hip hp and cheesy progressive

[tocsin]

Anyone who has a message of rebellion needs to accept the fact that it might not resonate with the public. Odds are, if it does, it's going to be a minority. In the north-east US, I personally feel like I'm bombarded by politics and entertainment, often wrapped into the same thing, all damn day. I know a number of people who just don't want to hear anything remotely affiliated with it at all by the end of the day. So, the "rebellion" shit is not really desired, whatever it is against. Most people would rather party music where they can forget about the other bullshit for a few hours and have some fun before the week starts over again. This always moves in cycles though. I think it's foolish to adopt a belief that there is nothing to rebel against. Pick what bothers you. There's something. Poverty, death and disease all continue to exist as a result of both systemic action and inaction. Besides, I think the cycle is going to shift soon because the status quo of music centering around hedonism is
starting to get dull for people again. Unless you believe that filesharing is the true evil cause that has caused slumps in sales over the years, record sales are showing that there is a population that has gotten disinterested with the current formulas.

[schlongfingers]

Hmm, I think rebellion against the status quo is almost the entire point of techno - its a quest against the mundane, the ordinary and the establishment.

[Joseph Isaac]

...the kids need a message they can chant and get angry about and agree with.

However, it is my understanding that most kids into dance music don't get angry...they are about peace and love and understanding and acceptance and all that other crap. One of the reasons i was into the punk/hardcore scene way back when is because it ignited a flame inside me about social, political, and environmental issues and policies. I still get this from some hard techno, but not most. How are we to get the kids angry about something to the point of them revolting (for lack of a better word) against even musical and social norms? It doesn't appear that dance music, at least from my perspective, is the proper musical medium for this.

[Internal Error Records]

i agree.

there is genres of electronic music that may be a good medium for angst....

but dance music isnt the kind of music that people want to stop dancing to and say 'yeaha thats another thing i should be pissed out'

moshers and dancers arent the same :-)

[dirty_bass]

...the kids need a message they can chant and get angry about and agree with.

However, it is my understanding that most kids into dance music don't get angry...they are about peace and love and understanding and acceptance and all that other crap. One of the reasons i was into the punk/hardcore scene way back when is because it ignited a flame inside me about social, political, and environmental issues and policies. I still get this from some hard techno, but not most. How are we to get the kids angry about something to the point of them revolting (for lack of a better word) against even musical and social norms? It doesn't appear that dance music, at least from my perspective, is the proper musical medium for this.

I think my point has been taken too literally.
The point is, it that us oldies have had time to get into techno. We understand it, and found our way in via other dance music (in most cases)
For most of the younger generation, they see dance music (and techno) as some music played by aging, wealthy, middle class, intellectual bores.
I mean, there aren`t any people in the scene with any presence.
Well, maybe EG, as he performs as he performs.
I don`t necessarily mean rebelion. Just any kind of message at all.
Techno is totally open to interpretation, and the younger generation need an identifier to bring them into the music.

There are no in roads to dance music any more, via the mainstream.
Back in the 90`s we had Prodigy, Chemical Brothers, Underworld, The Shaman, KLF etc that prvided the bridge between the commercial and the underground.

Now we have nothing.
Well, Eric Prydz and the other pop shite, that does nothing for the music except make people believe the cliches and turn them off.

The problem for me still comes down to the fact that there aren`t many musicians making techno. There are a lot of DJ`s who learned to produce making trax, that don`t necessarily have the musical content to make them memorable.

Music by DJ`s for DJ`s.
And no one really wants to be a DJ any more, as the "I want to be like paul oakenfold" fashion has gone.

[dirty_bass]

Now that`s not to say I don`t love the music.
I do.
But as a whole, musically things feel a little still right now.

[tocsin]

You hit on a somewhat good point about the mainstream inroads. Now, think about what they all had.... vocals.

[Internal Error Records]

...the kids need a message they can chant and get angry about and agree with.

However, it is my understanding that most kids into dance music don't get angry...they are about peace and love and understanding and acceptance and all that other crap. One of the reasons i was into the punk/hardcore scene way back when is because it ignited a flame inside me about social, political, and environmental issues and policies. I still get this from some hard techno, but not most. How are we to get the kids angry about something to the point of them revolting (for lack of a better word) against even musical and social norms? It doesn't appear that dance music, at least from my perspective, is the proper musical medium for this.

I think my point has been taken too literally.
The point is, it that us oldies have had time to get into techno. We understand it, and found our way in via other dance music (in most cases)
For most of the younger generation, they see dance music (and techno) as some music played by aging, wealthy, middle class, intellectual bores.
I mean, there aren`t any people in the scene with any presence.
Well, maybe EG, as he performs as he performs.
I don`t necessarily mean rebelion. Just any kind of message at all.
Techno is totally open to interpretation, and the younger generation need an identifier to bring them into the music.

There are no in roads to dance music any more, via the mainstream.
Back in the 90`s we had Prodigy, Chemical Brothers, Underworld, The Shaman, KLF etc that prvided the bridge between the commercial and the underground.

Now we have nothing.
Well, Eric Prydz and the other pop shite, that does nothing for the music except make people believe the cliches and turn them off.

The problem for me still comes down to the fact that there aren`t many musicians making techno. There are a lot of DJ`s who learned to produce making trax, that don`t necessarily have the musical content to make them memorable.

Music by DJ`s for DJ`s.
And no one really wants to be a DJ any more, as the "I want to be like paul oakenfold" fashion has gone.

i agree with DB 100%. This dj 4 dj stuff has gone on too long. Its gotta be about the party/or the message. (at least one of the two).

kids need an emotional hook, something that will make them proud to be tech heads when walkign down the street.

i dunno about this rebellion stuff though. although kids love to believe their generation is going to be the one that changes the world.

[detfella]

no music revolutions is like saying no major scientific discovers...

imo, the differences between disco - house - techno - trance are pretty slim. it wasnt a major musical breakthru to add a 4/4 kick drum to a disco track but it inspired a revolution so to speak.

ive heard lots of new music that sounds very fresh to my ears, i posted a link about a new (and what i thought was a revolutionairy) program but it got slammed for being unmusically inspiring and no one seemed interested.

here's another discovery for you all to ignore ;) http://www.newscientist.com/article.ns?id=dn7247

there are many synthesis techniques that have yet to be explored & discovered (i made a vst that uses synthesis that no one else has used yet - tho its v buggy!!). the majority of software synths model exsisting musical instruments & designs. dsp has not been around that long and it takes time to discover things & even more time for them to become aimed at musicians.

just my thoughts :)

[detfella]

You hit on a somewhat good point about the mainstream inroads. Now, think about what they all had.... vocals.

ahahah this is true. we learnt in uni that people who don't play a musical instrument (or make music whateva) the first thing they latch onto is vocals. so for mass sales (if thats what the plan is) vocals are much more important.

me, i don't really like vocals that much, much prefer to hear some crazy drum break that makes my head explode and my teeth shatter :twisted:

the message of techno? for me its to get down & party hard. it's the tribalness and groove that i love in techno being in that dark club screaming your head off and letting out your emotions. i'm sure we all have our own opiions about what techno stands for.

[Internal Error Records]

i think techno's nebulousness allows headz to plug in the emotional meanings they want their techno to have.

vocal clips/samples/ or sound effects that people can connect with specific emotions help re-enforce the listeners interpretation of their tunes.

i personally lean towards ghetto/techno because the vocal samples tend to re-enforce my favorite topics - pride, ass, and overcoming obstacles.

[dirty_bass]

no music revolutions is like saying no major scientific discovers...

imo, the differences between disco - house - techno - trance are pretty slim. it wasnt a major musical breakthru to add a 4/4 kick drum to a disco track but it inspired a revolution so to speak.

ive heard lots of new music that sounds very fresh to my ears, i posted a link about a new (and what i thought was a revolutionairy) program but it got slammed for being unmusically inspiring and no one seemed interested.

here's another discovery for you all to ignore ;) http://www.newscientist.com/article.ns?id=dn7247

there are many synthesis techniques that have yet to be explored & discovered (i made a vst that uses synthesis that no one else has used yet - tho its v buggy!!). the majority of software synths model exsisting musical instruments & designs. dsp has not been around that long and it takes time to discover things & even more time for them to become aimed at musicians.

just my thoughts :)


Sub vocal detection. They`ve been looking to do that for ages.
Not sure it`ll help with music though.
Yes there will be new technology, and lots of cool new music.
#but I think it`ll be more cult phenominan now, than revolution.
Not that that is a bad thing.
It feels like you`ve discovered it yourself when it is cult and underground
But a music revolution, isn`t just about the music.
It`s about a new cultural phenominon.
I think the way music has been treated in the last few years has kind of devalued the power of music.
We had rock n roll, and punk, industrial, new wave, electro, hip hop, grunge dance.
And now rnb and hip hop again.
They influence fashion, attitude, etc.
I`m not so sure this will happen again due to the controlling nature of media.

I mean, look at the hippy movement, it was huge, and everyone thought it would change the world.
Now most of the hippies of the 60`s, are the corporate chiefs of the noughties (bill gates, phil knight etc)

There seems to be a retrospective fashion that has lasted for a while now.
All the new music coming out, is a homage to previous era`s.
It`s even filtered into holywood now, with every other god damn film being a remake. Dawn of the Dead, Assualt on precinct 13, flight of the phoenix, get carter, the italian job, alfie, the list goes on.

Is the world in some kind of post millenial depression or something?

I think everyone expected the world to change on new ears eve 1999

That we`d all wake up to some fabulous utopia, or that the second coming would happen, or flying cars would appear or something.
And everyone woke up with a hangover and realised that the day was just the same as before?

Anyway, this is all more of a philosophical discussion. But it`s interesting to talk about it.

[The Divide]

New Punk bands aren`t saying anything anymore, they are just image.
There are no spitting, shagging, phuck you all, smash it all up, kill your idols, drunken drug crazed rock n roll stars any more.
It`s all been sanitised.


But then surely having that '**** everyone and the establishment' attitude is all about image? That’s part of the reason kids get into it. It’s the by-product of teenage insecurity. Like a defence mechanism. A hard outer shell. Which for me, seems to be the main reason young people who listen to shranze, gabber & other aggressive, abrasive hardcorish spin offs.

Re: younger people. I don’t know, perhaps it’s a Northern thing but it seems like there are more young people ‘Chaved up’ with the latest bling bling N ting. Not really passionate about music just going out, getting pissed up and what not.

I guess my personal views on this are very similar to what rounser is saying. We cannot foresee the next ‘revolution’ because in our minds everything has gone as far as it can go. If you could see these things coming before you would arrive then you would make an excellent prophet. I am not personally feeling this point of view because I feel like we are submerged with technology which is evolving faster than ever before.

I always thought that a generation tends to reach a certain musical level then remain static. This seemed to make sense at the time as most the old people I know still listen to old music without a care in the word. Perhaps change is amidst? I'm just not feeling the end times yet. Perhaps I am a little naïve…

[detfella]

ok i see where u're coming from now ;)

i read an article with a dance musician a while back (i forget who) but he said for a revolution to start you need three things:

1. new drugs
2. new fashion
3. new music

i agree at the moment people are tending to look behind them and then try to develop new things, but surely this is what has happened for all music changes? i can't think of too many situations where new music was created from nothing

[tocsin]

I really think if people miss the inroads between the underground and the mainstream, you need to work on some stuff with vocals, whether it's samples or original. At least in the States, the music seemed to get played out when the mainstream realised that vocals in techno equated sales and the vocalists/vocals they used in the tracks just felt like forced cameo appearances. Hell, for all of the good acid-breaks/breaks that was coming out of the US at one point, I never heard one track where original vocals were used that didn't sound completely forced. The Prodigy had catchy vocals earlier on before they seemed to get lost in the limelight. Experience was full of enough repeated samples that they funcitoned as vocals and people I knew who don't like techno like that album because they can follow it without getting bored. All of the Shaman, KLF and Underworld tracks that I remember the most as getting the most play my way (L.S.I., What Time is Love, Born Slippy and Cowgirl) all had noticable vocals.
Not so surprisingly, friends of mine who do not like techno at all liked those tracks, bought some albums and would even come out to party with me every now and then. Think about Orbital's most recognized song. If you ask the common listener, it will probably be Halcyon. Unlike a lot of shit I heard coming out after 1996, these tracks had vocals that added a dimension to the song. They didn't stand out like something that was thrown in for the purpose of having some name do vocals in a track. Rather, the words were part of the track. The US mainstream lost sight of this by trying to mix it with the dumb cult of celebrity shit. I mean, if Julliette Lewis singing[?] crappy stilted lyrics on arguably the worst Prodigy album released to date is not proof, what is? Did the vocals in that rather annoying Chemical Brothers track "Setting Sun" really add anything cool to it or did it seem like Oasis and the Chem Bros were trying to work on hype. Do the Q-Tip vocals for Galvanise make the song any less
boring? Do they even sound like they were in mind when the song was being written? You got the mainstream side now that just seems to be focussing on the wrong variables when it comes to vocals (ie. personality) whereas the not so mainstream side of techno seems to have forgotten about vocals almost entirely. Honestly, I think if you see some people really working on new songs with fresh implementations of vocals again that actually fit with the song as a whole and not a disjointed added component, you'll see some more people getting into techno again if not a revolution.

[Internal Error Records]

in terms of pop appeal - true vocals might also work much better than ganked samples.

im still waiting for the day that GreenVelvet blows over to the mainstream. . .

[tocsin]

^^^ Hell, it would certainly be easier on you legally.

[The Divide]

Is the world in some kind of post millenial depression or something?

Could be! When you think about it the millennia is meaningless anyways. All it signifies is 2000 years since the time when someone decided to start Gregorian time. Perhaps in the back of our minds we thought everything was going to go more futurist. Mind you it is in a way

hmmm well maybe not :lol: . Im having my millennia on 2012 because im a bigger fan of Mayan time myself

Anyways back to the revolution...

[The Divide]

Maybe this because of exhaustive corporate capitalisation on everything we can possibly think about. You know like everything is fake, manufactured, overdone. Like we are living on a Hollywood movie set. Nothing feels new

Ide say if there’s going to be another revolution it’s probably going to be some kind of backlash against all the bullshit we are surrounded in. But the problem with that is that it could what’s holding together our present day society and its undoing could lead to the unknown.

And by that time people start doing things that the law will have you arrested under new anti-terror laws :lol:

[detfella]

Maybe this because of exhaustive corporate capitalisation on everything we can possibly think about. You know like everything is fake, manufactured, overdone. Like we are living on a Hollywood movie set. Nothing feels new

Ide say if there’s going to be another revolution it’s probably going to be some kind of backlash against all the bullshit we are surrounded in. But the problem with that is that it could what’s holding together our present day society and its undoing could lead to the unknown.

And by that time people start doing things that the law will have you arrested under new anti-terror laws :lol:

i was listening to program that was saying that humans have created a world in which we find it hard to adapt to, instead of developing things that are already known to us by way of nature.

they are now wanting to commercially develop programmable matter. so that wall in your living room can be programmed to have a huge stain glass window or a moving window to follow the sun.

we are destined to live amongst the machines, well that is until 06.06.06 :lol:

[SlavikSvensk]

here's some food for thought...

...maybe music-based subcultures are never as revolutionary as we think when we are young, idealistic, and naive...but are, rather, an expression of the world around them...

[fresh_an_funky_design]

jebus...

what the **** is it with the constant apocolyptic fear that techno and its mediums is gonna get stripped away from everybody.

everybody needs to loosen up, get **** up and have a good time.

techno aint dying.

i dont see junglists with a fear that their genre is going away.



i agree with you here, everyone seems to be bothered about this that an everything else. If life is that shit then you really need to get down to your next techno night an have a good old stomp to some pounding beats, an don't give a **** if its a loopy techno or ifits not hard enuf or deep enuf. Just ****ing dance an enjoy yourself.

[Evil G]

i'll have to agree with crime and db.

we do have more to rebel against than ever, but when i look around, i don't see the same level of activism, of protest, of *caring* for the world that i saw 15-20 years ago. it's as if the environmentalists have lost. the peace-niks have lost. social justice movements have lost. the machine grinds on. we are burning more fuel than ever before, despite the fact we've known we needed to cut down for decades already. unjust wars are being waged. new, more powerful weapons are being developed when we already have more than enough to destroy the world.

the only people fighting the good fight anymore are those too ignorant and uneducated to realize that it is a losing battle. for the majority of people, reality is simply too ugly and depressing to face, and the powers that be are too strong to fight, so they are giving up, turning off, and trying to get their piece of the pie before there is none left.

how many years ago did REM sing "it's the end of the world as we know it, and i feel fine."?

[Joseph Isaac]

You hit on a somewhat good point about the mainstream inroads. Now, think about what they all had.... vocals.

Man, i was just having this discussion with Markus Alan last week! I was talking about how i want to start adding vocals to techno-inspired tracks. Not a new concept, but something i find interesting and may be the key to bridging the gap...Excellent point.

[Joseph Isaac]

Not so surprisingly, friends of mine who do not like techno at all liked those tracks, bought some albums and would even come out to party with me every now and then.

Exactly my point!

[xfive]

I don't think adding vocals is necessarily going to help anything... it may attract a few more people who may have been too closed minded at first to listen to purely instrumental techno... but if you think about it.. how many popular genres are largely instrumental?
A LOT of jazz... classical.... etc.. you don't see them worrying about losing a listener base or anything because fact of the matter is its just flat out small to begin with.

I think we should just realize that this type of music is only going to attract certain people, and we should concentrate on getting the people we know that like this stuff to stop making excuses and come out to the parties, instead of trying to make up reasons as to why more people aren't getting interested in it. Did all those people who were into the scene years back just vanish??? Do they not like techno anymore?? I doubt it.... they just got bored of the parties... same old thing over an over..
I think if we can get people out of the woodworks who already like it, and have them then drag their oblivious friends with them..... who knows what will happen... they just might end up liking it. BUT
These experiences have to be presented in a proper format... If you take someone to their first techno night you will need to BLOW their minds...... can't just have some tiny dark pub/club with some lame-o lighting and some shitty speakers.... only the diehards will come out for that ... if even...

This means better promotions, better parties, better vibe... better format all around.

That's what got me into techno after all.... not accessiblity.

[dirty_bass]

Yes this is true, but at the same time, any scene needs youth to keep it alive.

"Give us your children"
hehe

[xfive]

hahah

Yeah no doubt... but music takes time to grow on people.. and if their first experience sucks ass... they will likely attribute the music to being the same... give them a reason to come back, and they'll start diggin it.

[j_s]

New Punk bands aren`t saying anything anymore, they are just image.
There are no spitting, shagging, phuck you all, smash it all up, kill your idols, drunken drug crazed rock n roll stars any more.
It`s all been sanitised.
The only thing we have now, to replace the true anit everything rock star is people like 50 cent
A pimp and gangster who has been shot 9 times, made a lot of money and sold out as soon as the dollars were flashed in front of him.
Not really a rebel against the system.
But a product of the system.

What we need is some good, old fashioned anarchy and rebellion, with a bit of intelligence.
Something with a message above
"sell drugs, make money, kill people, take their money, shag birds, make money, make money, make money, get shot, make money"

.

grime? still very much based around macho attitude & the bollocks that goes with it (though not exlusively) , but it seems a lot more real & down to earth than the US based stuff. the music itself sounds quite fresh to me, too...

[dirty_bass]

I dunno about grime.
Sounds to me like old monoid stuff and rush and landstrumm.
I wouldn`t really say it`s all that fresh

[tocsin]

the only people fighting the good fight anymore are those too ignorant and uneducated to realize that it is a losing battle. for the majority of people, reality is simply too ugly and depressing to face, and the powers that be are too strong to fight, so they are giving up, turning off, and trying to get their piece of the pie before there is none left.

Man, I really hope this isn't the case. This is def a tangent, but, it's way too early to say that it's a losing battle. Look at how far humanity has progressed by fighting oppression in just the past couple hundred years. It's not that it's a losing battle. It's that we have a long way to go before reaching a truly just and fair society. When people give up, those who would **** us and oppress others are more than happy to step in and take back what we have gained. Music has always been a great means of advancing radical or revolutionary ideas. So, hell, if that's someone's thing, there is still plenty to write about which might even move some people in your direction.


I don't think adding vocals is necessarily going to help anything... it may attract a few more people who may have been too closed minded at first to listen to purely instrumental techno... but if you think about it.. how many popular genres are largely instrumental?

I don't think it has anything to do with being closed-minded. Like I said, a number of my friends bought full albums of various artists after hearing the vocal tracks and bumped 'em for awhile. Just like some people are suckers for a 303, some people are suckers for good vocals. Personally, I really miss original vocals in techno. It's very cool to hear how people have implemented a human element over the machines. The more diverse your sound, the more diverse your audience which is good for longevity. Small followings die really quick especially when even the hardcore begin to lose interest. I dunno. It wouldn't surprise me if you hear more and more techno sounding stuff coming out of hip-hop. I'm just kinda surprised that the techno scene hasn't moved in the same direction outside of sampling yet for the most part. It just seems like a natural progression. That girl MIA has some pretty tech'd out production work for her stuff but it's not exactly being hyped towards the techno crowd around here.

[GothamGrooves.com]

I call out for a media channel to pump techno through, is that so hard? Can I get a kilowatt or 2 to broadcast with? lol

Media people, media is what drives all this shit! Our scene is largely word of mouth, its hard getting new kids into a scene they dont know about...

[OriginalTechnobastard]

and techno definatley isnt faceless or a rebel music anymore, with people like Natus and Arkus getting into the German chart's and the fact u can hear techno on radio 1 a few nights a week......

its got a face, just wether or not the face fits with u is a different matter...
Of course there is few chart success but it is still very un-mainstream.

Just because there is few night a week on radio one and couple of german success doesn't change the fact that 99% acts don't hit the top 40 and way of doing things in techno is pretty rebellious even though I don't care whether it is really or not(even though I like the way its against the norm things and there is so much room for creativity). Its good music end of the day and thats all that matters.

[OriginalTechnobastard]

And I think electronic music is the new punk

[TechMouse]

i made a vst that uses synthesis that no one else has used yet - tho its v buggy!!
Do elaborate...

[acidsaturation]

New Punk bands aren`t saying anything anymore, they are just image.
There are no spitting, shagging, phuck you all, smash it all up, kill your idols, drunken drug crazed rock n roll stars any more.
It`s all been sanitised.

Dunno what punk you're listening to, but I don't see this to be the case in bands I see in back rooms of pubs, squats and warehouses in Leeds etc. I think that yeah, some people are getting bored, doing it for image, but I still see plenty of the old anger, bile and spite. I think people have just realised a bit that they're never gonna "get anywhere" and be noticed by the "mainstream" and are just quite happy to keep it DIY and on a small scale.


Evil G wrote:
the only people fighting the good fight anymore are those too ignorant and uneducated to realize that it is a losing battle. for the majority of people, reality is simply too ugly and depressing to face, and the powers that be are too strong to fight, so they are giving up, turning off, and trying to get their piece of the pie before there is none left.


Man, I really hope this isn't the case. This is def a tangent, but, it's way too early to say that it's a losing battle. Look at how far humanity has progressed by fighting oppression in just the past couple hundred years. It's not that it's a losing battle. It's that we have a long way to go before reaching a truly just and fair society. When people give up, those who would **** us and oppress others are more than happy to step in and take back what we have gained. Music has always been a great means of advancing radical or revolutionary ideas. So, hell, if that's someone's thing, there is still plenty to write about which might even move some people in your direction.

I agree with that I really hope it ain't the case too. I think though what some people have realised is that they ain't gonna change the world, but they can do things on a smaller level and make a diffetrence for people close to them, locally or their community.

I think it was dirtybass who said in an unconnected thread, humanity is wiped out as the planet will then have better custodians (or words to that effect). I don't, but I do care about the people here now.

I'm going off on a tangent now, but going back on topic, I agree that we have more to stand up and shout bollox to than for a long time. I don't think people are letting it wash overthem though. Or maybe some are, but in my mind those who are not are fighting just as hard, but maybe on a more acheivable (local? underground? whatever?) level, be that through music or other forms of rebellion.

[Evil G]

this idea of shifting focus from global to local, and trying to make life more bareable for your crew and family, rather than giving up entirely, i like a lot, and i hope i'm wrong too. but i see way to many SUVs and big cars on the road, and it's quite shocking to see so many Americans gladly giving away their rights in the name of fighting terrorism.

i said what i did in response to the idea that there will be no more musical revolutions. i guess i didn't make that clear in the first post. of course music with lyrics will always out-sell music without lyrics, because it makes it easier to identify and remember tracks, and to buy them at a later time, than it is when one track blends smoothly into the next.

but even within genres that already use lyrics, for the most part, the lyrics don't have the weight behind them that they once did. when i was younger, we expected lyrics to *mean* something, either literally, or metaphorically, or preferably both. maybe i'm just out of touch (i really hope that actually) but it seems like the kids today are so used to empty lyrics that they don't even look for meaning there anymore, and would not recognize a truly powerful song if they heard it.

[The Divide]

Seems to be many crushed souls in here...

In a time of universal deceit - telling the truth is a revolutionary act. - George Orwell

Someone PM me when this revolution begins. :lol:

[Joseph Isaac]

and it's quite shocking to see so many Americans gladly giving away their rights in the name of fighting terrorism.


Careful here, not to get off topic, but not ALL of us are gladly giving away any rights...There are quite a bit of grass roots movements about in the US, especially on the West Coast, that directly defy the Bush Administration. My city, Portland, is the only one in the whole country that disallows the Homeland Security department to "snoop" on our residents. Some of us choose to do things like, rip off the IRS or ride a bike as opposed to driving, since we as individuals are truly powerless over the current administration (and that is the truth no matter how optimistic you are). I'm really not trying to get off topic, but i feel that the record must be set straight for believe it or not, the Americans you may see on TV or read about, don't necessarily represent the whole...

[Evil G]

^^^ that's good to hear.

[Komplex]

Music cannot die or be finished. There is no end. Each generation brings something new to the table while learning from the past. Thats how it's been for centuries.

The only thing that can come to an end is your own appreciation of music itself.

[davethedrummer]

i think the drugs have got old
and the new kids just dont find electronic music that great
but its still working in certain places , and it'll be around for a while longer.
but maybe there is a musical revolution going on right now and we just dont know about it................

[dirty_bass]

No music ever dies.
It`s just that dance music as a whole, is no longer the big thing.
Hmmm, I`m not sure how relevant the drugs issue is.

[crime]

but maybe there is a musical revolution going on right now and we just dont know about it................

Maybe if you were 17 and in the middle of the grime thing right now you could see it like that.. as I said before, maybe I'm just becoming older and I've just been around the block a few times, so I'm not as eager and enthusiastic as I used to be (I wish I could turn back the clock)

When I started this thread, it wasn't with the intention of potraying total doom on the whole thing, more just me picking up on something dirty bass said..

I don't think it's just a thing with techno but with a lot of things these days, just disposable culture...
there is some real good stuff out there, but you have to look harder through the fodder to find it...

[j_s]

i guess the speed at which music goes in and out of fashion is getting faster all the time, which makes sense really, it's always been that way (not just in music either). i suppose in that sense, movements don't seem as big or important & tend to splinter more quickly - no revolutions, no big shocks, but no progress? i'm not so sure...

[OriginalTechnobastard]

i think the drugs have got old
and the new kids just dont find electronic music that great
but its still working in certain places , and it'll be around for a while longer.
but maybe there is a musical revolution going on right now and we just dont know about it................

I don't know what you mean by drugs got old. But if its the notion that techno= drugs, I disagree. I hate these kind of things you hear about Techno. I always tell people I'm into Techno because of energy. And contrary to belief drugs is not old. There is about millions E being taken in Uk and most kids in US smoke dope and listen to rap if wondering about drug connection.

Why do we even need music rev. ? Its lame talking about it or even contemplating the idea of it.

I think if you are looking for why Techno is unpopular here is few opinions

1.People don't know about it(Most people outside of Europe don't)
2. People only consider it club music
3. Dance music has branched out (Trance DnB house)
4. People think its too hard or simple

Electronic music is great people just have to 'get it'

[crime]

Why do we even need music rev. ? Its lame talking about it or even contemplating the idea of it.

I think if you are looking for why Techno is unpopular here is few opinions

1.People don't know about it(Most people outside of Europe don't)
2. People only consider it club music
3. Dance music has branched out (Trance DnB house)
4. People think its too hard or simple

Electronic music is great people just have to 'get it'

This thread has nothing to do with techno being popular or unpopular..
it's about things not having an edge....
Please learn to read ;)

[tocsin]

i think the drugs have got old

They also started to get more expensive and less potent. Definitely seemed to burn a lot of people.


but maybe there is a musical revolution going on right now and we just dont know about it.

There it is. If your head is completely stuck in a music scene that already experienced what could be considered a revolution, chances are you're only going to hear about the next one after the fact.

[TechMouse]

Maybe if you were 17 and in the middle of the grime thing right now you could see it like that.. as I said before, maybe I'm just becoming older and I've just been around the block a few times, so I'm not as eager and enthusiastic as I used to be (I wish I could turn back the clock)
:clap: Yes, the whole dubstep thing is pretty cool. Though for my money it has to become less reliant on MCing as a driving force. But I digress.

Anyway, come on Mark, you're hardly old and you're still pushing the envelope with the music you release. Enjoy it.


I don't think it's just a thing with techno but with a lot of things these days, just disposable culture...
there is some real good stuff out there, but you have to look harder through the fodder to find it...
I don't know if you necessarily have to look harder than before - I think it's easy to think you shouldn't have to look so hard anymore because of the massive advances in the way media is delivered.

Unfortunatly you sson realise that the force pushing these things forward is large companies who have no interest in small labels (Techno or otherwise) succeeding.

They control the "media pipe", so to speak, so they choose what goes down it. Here... have another discardable, easily palatable, parent-friendly pop star. There's no way these people are ever going to want to push "good" music, because it's unpredictable.

There will always be people on the fringes who demand more, though, and these people will always find each other somehow. Which, when you think about it, is pretty much how it's always happened.

[crime]

Unfortunatly you sson realise that the force pushing these things forward is large companies who have no interest in small labels (Techno or otherwise) succeeding.
What are they pushing forward apart from their own bank balance?
Thanks for the props anyway, and yes, there is interesting stuff, my initial point was just the fact that when the first sativae and mosquito stuff was hitting back in 95/96 there did seem to be a lot more variety around, and it did feel like a new era was dawning, it was, but these things can't go on forever.. I suppose it's the old chesnut of the easier that music is to understand, the more it's going to sell.. also when you are newer to the music it's going to seem fresher, just after 5+ years of being involved in the industry doing your thing, an you still have trouble affording to live it can get a little frustrating, but I suppose it's the price you pay for doing this thing full time...
Being in germany, berlin in particular is certainly more inspiring, the UK scene seems quite narrow in comparison, and it's great to have very talented people around to bounce ideas off and give you advice and inspiration...

[OriginalTechnobastard]

Why do we even need music rev. ? Its lame talking about it or even contemplating the idea of it.

I think if you are looking for why Techno is unpopular here is few opinions

1.People don't know about it(Most people outside of Europe don't)
2. People only consider it club music
3. Dance music has branched out (Trance DnB house)
4. People think its too hard or simple

Electronic music is great people just have to 'get it'

This thread has nothing to do with techno being popular or unpopular..
it's about things not having an edge....
Please learn to read ;)

it just seems that way

[TechMouse]

Unfortunatly you sson realise that the force pushing these things forward is large companies who have no interest in small labels (Techno or otherwise) succeeding.
What are they pushing forward apart from their own bank balance?
Oh, I just mean in terms of technology.

e.g. iPods, mp3, HDTV, cable, satellite, take your pick out of the million or so different methods that have been developed to shovel shite into the mouths of the intellectually dubious.

[tocsin]

MP3 was not pushed on us by the industry. Not in the slightest. Most of the MP3s you saw floating around years ago were all made with hacked (aka. stolen) derivitives of the Fraunhofer codec. When your online distribution options for supposed "quality" compression were Real Audio, MP3 was great. With a whopping 5k transfer rate on my modem if I was lucky, I could get decent sounding tracks from friends without having to sacrifice quality by going the Real Audio route. MP3 wasn't exactly scaring the crap out of, or even being discussed by, the mainstream industry at the time. It wasn't until they figured out that kids with broadband connections were now trading entire albums around the world in a matter of minutes that the mainstream got interested. They saw that Napster obviously had a marketing scheme in mind. The end result was that the industry was forced to accept MP3. They never wanted it. So, they litigate the hell out of some existing entities while they start up their own similar pay
service. MP3 became big because of techno geeks who continued to expand on ideas to make it more user accessable. That was, and still is an ongoing, revolution. You hadn't seen the music industry get so pissy since the advent of blank tapes. They found a way to deal with that by adding a surcharge to sales of blank tapes. But, in the US at least, that surcharge can't be applied to computer storage media (aka blank CD-Rs) and how do you put a surcharge on a technology that is out of your control? It's why I'm so pro-MP3 or any other compression method that makes delivery of information easy and good for the masses. It's basically our doing. It would make the industry nothing but happy to see MP3 and digital distribution completely disappear. At that point, they hold all the cards again.

[j_s]

Maybe if you were 17 and in the middle of the grime thing right now you could see it like that.. as I said before, maybe I'm just becoming older and I've just been around the block a few times, so I'm not as eager and enthusiastic as I used to be (I wish I could turn back the clock)
:clap: Yes, the whole dubstep thing is pretty cool. Though for my money it has to become less reliant on MCing as a driving force. But I digress.



i dunno. i think lyrics & vocal lines are what give the music a wider appeal. theres decent 'instrumental' stuff about too, but i can't see it pulling as big an audience as say, dizzee rascal. and i do believe a decent audience is necessary for a movement to really kick off.

[crime]

i dunno. i think lyrics & vocal lines are what give the music a wider appeal. theres decent 'instrumental' stuff about too, but i can't see it pulling as big an audience as say, dizzee rascal. and i do believe a decent audience is necessary for a movement to really kick off.

Dizzee rascal is from that scene and still producing underground records, go to hackney and turn the radio on, it's already kicking off....

[crime]

MP3 was not pushed on us by the industry. Not in the slightest. Most of the MP3s you saw floating around years ago were all made with hacked (aka. stolen) derivitives of the Fraunhofer codec. When your online distribution options for supposed "quality" compression were Real Audio, MP3 was great. With a whopping 5k transfer rate on my modem if I was lucky, I could get decent sounding tracks from friends without having to sacrifice quality by going the Real Audio route. MP3 wasn't exactly scaring the crap out of, or even being discussed by, the mainstream industry at the time. It wasn't until they figured out that kids with broadband connections were now trading entire albums around the world in a matter of minutes that the mainstream got interested. They saw that Napster obviously had a marketing scheme in mind. The end result was that the industry was forced to accept MP3. They never wanted it. So, they litigate the hell out of some existing entities while they start up their own similar pay
service. MP3 became big because of techno geeks who continued to expand on ideas to make it more user accessable. That was, and still is an ongoing, revolution. You hadn't seen the music industry get so pissy since the advent of blank tapes. They found a way to deal with that by adding a surcharge to sales of blank tapes. But, in the US at least, that surcharge can't be applied to computer storage media (aka blank CD-Rs) and how do you put a surcharge on a technology that is out of your control? It's why I'm so pro-MP3 or any other compression method that makes delivery of information easy and good for the masses. It's basically our doing. It would make the industry nothing but happy to see MP3 and digital distribution completely disappear. At that point, they hold all the cards again.

Do you buy records or cds at all?

[dirty_bass]

, go to hackney and turn the radio on, it's already kicking off....

I would but some crackhead hackney ****er nicked it.

[tocsin]

Do you buy records or cds at all?

Not nearly as much as I used to.

[TechMouse]

i dunno. i think lyrics & vocal lines are what give the music a wider appeal. theres decent 'instrumental' stuff about too, but i can't see it pulling as big an audience as say, dizzee rascal. and i do believe a decent audience is necessary for a movement to really kick off.
That's fair. The MCing makes it a bit more unique set against the rest of the whole broken beat electronica thing, and it certainly gives it the rude boy edge that is probably helping to keep it afloat.

I really want to get down to one of those Rephlex nights at the Elektrowerkz.

I'd love to see Vex'd, particularly.

[The Overfiend]

I really think that there is a lot of good music out there, bottom line is to take the time out to look for it. Yes hip hop is not what it used to be but if you look youll find some hella good underground material. Same with techno if you look youll find granted itll be maybe 2 out of 10 ratio but there are some of us really trying to break the mold, dont know about the next biggest sound but im just saying quality material is out there its about being objective about it.

[OriginalTechnobastard]

Why do we even need music rev. ? Its lame talking about it or even contemplating the idea of it.

I think if you are looking for why Techno is unpopular here is few opinions

1.People don't know about it(Most people outside of Europe don't)
2. People only consider it club music
3. Dance music has branched out (Trance DnB house)
4. People think its too hard or simple

Electronic music is great people just have to 'get it'

This thread has nothing to do with techno being popular or unpopular..
it's about things not having an edge....
Please learn to read ;)

Ahh I've said if, get the glasses on crime. There was a discussion going on about why Techno is unpopular (its going on right here too) so I've responded to it also it was reaction dtd's post.

Music revolution in 60's gave us hippies and beatles. Not good ha?

As for Dizzee yeah he is pretty revolution. Check the Jayz imitation of that shite tune out of Showcase. Pretty shite attempt to break the sales. The video was even worse.

[The Divide]

I really think that there is a lot of good music out there, bottom line is to take the time out to look for it.

Me too, over all syles of music. There is always something which stands out

I also dont mind pulling out all the stuff I used to listen years ago

Music will always take me places

[holotropik]

There is little value placed on the creative elements of music in general (in fact all arts are suffering this). It has become something that is controlled by guidelines in order to make it a reliable commmodity that can then be "farmed" on a more regular basis.

The "product" is now cruely cultivated and marketed in a way that has become the accepted norm. Artists are seen but not heard as the values and meaning of their music is filtered to become something that is politically correct and swallowed more easily by the public at large. More often than not this is done via having the artists rehash old favourites through some cheesy cover of a song that has long since passed it used by date.

So, yes music is dead coz its meaning and purpose are lost.

Funny how the authorities would now find it more comfortable to carry on with their corrupted ways having lost the voice of contention that so regularly sparked outcry against their attrocities......

[Lady Melodie]

As history will tell you... In every major musical changes there was a new instrument or technic that was created. For exemple, classical music was invented 'cause the piano made it's first debut.And they've explored all the ways that they could imagine with it. Even in the mathematical way of speaking( ex: a 3/4 beat , a Waltz... it's a way of saying that they were close to be at the top of their art if not with Chopin).
Is there any classical music played and composed still today?
Of coarse it was great back in the days but a new generation is there, with new problems and philosiphies... What can we do about it?

[dirty_bass]

Is there any classical music played and composed still today?


Err, yes, loads and loads.
And yes it is played, both on the radio, and in concerts, with a greater fan base than techno, and with higher sales, better distribution, erm, need I go on?

[crime]

There is little value placed on the creative elements of music in general (in fact all arts are suffering this). It has become something that is controlled by guidelines in order to make it a reliable commmodity that can then be "farmed" on a more regular basis.

The "product" is now cruely cultivated and marketed in a way that has become the accepted norm. Artists are seen but not heard as the values and meaning of their music is filtered to become something that is politically correct and swallowed more easily by the public at large. More often than not this is done via having the artists rehash old favourites through some cheesy cover of a song that has long since passed it used by date.

So, yes music is dead coz its meaning and purpose are lost.

Funny how the authorities would now find it more comfortable to carry on with their corrupted ways having lost the voice of contention that so regularly sparked outcry against their attrocities......

Bang on.. this was exactly the point I was trying to make, that the artistic value is lost and it's become pure product...

[schlongfingers]

The future is happening, it's just getting it's head down and honing it's sound, not blathering away on the internet about compression techniques, how to get 'signed' and whether it is 'ok' to use technique xyz.

Imho of course.

[crime]

The future is happening, it's just getting it's head down and honing it's sound, not blathering away on the internet about compression techniques, how to get 'signed' and whether it is 'ok' to use technique xyz.

Again, bang on.....

[miss bass]

There is some amazingly produced musics out there from all sorts of styles, the key is to listen to all sorts not just alot of the shitty techno out now, and put those influences into your own shit as we all know.

I hear so many pieces where Yeh the compression might be good, a full sound but the material grabs about as much of my mind as a boiled egg. Theres so much shit like that out there, but looking much further and their are beautiful musics.

Thank the lord for Plaid, Errorsmith, Geoff White, Alex Under, Maurizio, Inigo Kennedy and Gorecki, and !! Detroit Underground !! etc etc KLASHNEKOFF / Manuva

[crime]

I hear so many pieces where Yeh the compression might be good, a full sound but the material grabs about as much of my mind as a boiled egg. Theres so much shit like that out there, but looking much further and their are beautiful musics.
Yeah, they production over content thing had always puzzled me in techno, personally I'd rather have a more interesting tune with rough production than a boring track with good production any day..

[miss bass]

I can understand to a certain degree how pieces should be made to their fullest potential if possible, theres nothing better , and thankfully im getting my own head down learning as much as poss to do the same. I think i am one for picking a tune with with great musical content than a piece which loops but has nice compression on the hats. Maybe thats the classical influenced side of me, just hearing those raw instruments and dynamics, (but then again synths dont always sound so phat unless produced / engineered well. Maybe comparing a soft synth to classical could be a little extreme hehe)

One thing ive learnt....

HOW HARD PRODUCTION IS.

Thats why its so amazing, and if you get producers who can engineer as well as making a well produced tune musically i.e Geoff WHite and all the others i mentioned then Hallelujah.