How important is Adam Beyer to techno?

[SlavikSvensk]

i figure he has been one of the most influential figures in techno from 1997-2005. a lot of his productions, IMO, are fantastic, but it also seems that he has spawned a lot of mediocre clones...

so i figured he's not only hugely influential, but probably also likely to stir up some passions on the board...

just curious what people think...i don't really want beyer-bashing replies, but well thought out opinions on the man...

[conflict]

well it was his tunes and his labels that got me into techno so obviously i rate the guy

;)

[The Overfiend]

I don't think he gives himself that much credit.
he's just a guy like the rest of us.
As far as biters.....
I havent reall heard people much eminate him.

[g]

regardless of whether or not it was your taste or even whether you 'approve' of the mark it left (in most respects, i don't), you can't argue that Drumcode in particular was hugely influential. esp in the early days, '96 - '97. not even a matter of who might have imitated/taken up the sound... i think that label is the reason a lot of sounds later happened.

[SlavikSvensk]

well, i'm a huge fan of his slower melodic records...i'm talking about conceiled project pattern 1-4 or stocktown city on rotation. hell...or even the truesoul album.

but it's his drum tracks that were so influential. i LOVE the first safety sessions record, and a couple of the code reds, of course...but generally i don't like these as much as the aforementioned melodic stuff...

[StoQ]

i'm not sure about his influence on developing new techno sound, but definatly, he has done loads of quality releases and played worldwide, so it makes him a BIG techno head.

[Mirsha]

I think he's very important, I mean he came out of nowhere and really helped develop a style of music. Drumcode is/was (I dunno anymore) the biggest selling techno label and created many important releases.

Like many people, Adam Beyer was the first techno I got into due to someone at a club saying to me "I've got that track, it's cracking and it's by Adam Beyer"

[lau]

He definitly did it for me...

He used to be uge in Holland... and actually still is.. though I´m not into the music he produces at the moment..

Ennieway still playing loads of his old records t... they just rock...

[gumpy green]

hes really good but not that important to techno..

i dont think anybody is NOW. back in the day yes..

it could easily survive without anybody now.

[SlavikSvensk]

yeah i meant "important to making techno what it is today." influence.

[gunjack]

"How important is Adam Beyer to techno?" i would say not important enough to have even made this ( :doh: ) lame assed thread. beyer ain't originate shit, he just gave that mass produced, ikea feel to the raw shit glenn already had going imo.

[SlavikSvensk]

"How important is Adam Beyer to techno?" i would say not important enough to have even made this ( :doh: ) lame assed thread. beyer ain't originate shit, he just gave that mass produced, ikea feel to the raw shit glenn already had going imo.

most of what you say is subjective, but this is one reason i posted this thread. this thread is about influence, not originality. look back at g's post...he's not a fan, but he sees the point of this thread quite clearly, i think...

maybe you (proverbial you, not you specifically) like beyer, maybe you don't. maybe you credit him--or maybe you blame him--for things we have a lot of--or too much of--today. either way, it speaks to his influence on where techno is today, not a lack therof.

i don't happen to be a beyer-hater, but i also acknowledge that tons of people i think blow are hugely influential, and i also think that its my least favorite beyer records that have shaped today's techno more than the ones i really like.

[Fordy]

The guy is a legend imo, his essential mix got me into techno and is still my favourite ever techno mix. Love his older productions and love the way he is going now, especially the mad eye stuff.

I think he has been hugely influential to techno with all his labels and he has help make techno what it is.

Cannot fault the guy, only wish to see him play more often.

[detfella]

that remix he did of sims manipulated is classic. i lost my mind to that when it was playing in orbit :twisted:

[dirty_bass]

In terms of influence, HUGE
his tunes and his mixes dominated opinion for ages in the main stream-ish end of techno.
I`m sure loads of people got into techno because of beyer. Original or not.

[massplanck]

"How important is Adam Beyer to techno?" i would say not important enough to have even made this ( :doh: ) lame assed thread. beyer ain't originate shit, he just gave that mass produced, ikea feel to the raw shit glenn already had going imo.


OK forgive me for you have lost me.

1995 Adam Beyer Releases on Planet Rhythm
1996 Adam Beyer releases 'Compressed' on Drumcode
1998 Glenn releases his first tracks on Colors (I think)

Glenn wilson pretty much signed/found/discovered? beyer and liked what he saw/heard.

What are you talking about? Regis , Hawtin & now Beyer 'sux' for copying Glenn Wilson?

:clap:

[tocsin]

I'm actually not sure I've heard a single one of his tracks. Or, if I have (which is possible I guess), I just didn't know.

[massplanck]

Dont you just love those clappy smilies?

[SlavikSvensk]

I'm actually not sure I've heard a single one of his tracks. Or, if I have (which is possible I guess), I just didn't know.

did you ever go hear hard techno between 1997 and the present? if so, you probably have.

[SlavikSvensk]

Dont you just love those clappy smilies?

yes, they liven up "crappy ass threads"

i also like these...need to use them more...

:protest:

[Mindful]

:protest: :protest: :protest: Beyer Beyer Beyer Beyer

[SlavikSvensk]

:protest: :protest: :protest: Beyer Beyer Beyer Beyer

:wicked: :study: :headache: :lol:

[detfella]

:clap:

[massplanck]

:clap:

:clap:

[Mindful]

:clap:

:clap:

:lol:

[RDR]

:clap:

:clap:

:lol:

:liar:

non of you know smilies the way i do...




:dow: :lal: :0

see.

[RDR]

PS i like beyer.

that mr sliff on jehrico 02 still floats me boat ;)

[SlavikSvensk]

yes, now shall we return to adam beyer discussion?

he is influential...but why?

[The Overfiend]

That Re-Manipulated record isn't anything that wasn't done by any Nyc Puerto Rican producer back in 95.
I.e yo fellas boriqua posse
stuff like that.
Check the reference.

[massplanck]

Its all about the Code Red series if we are talking influential. as in Label & Stuff Beyer released. That Sim Remanipulated remix shouldnt come into the fray unless you suddenly became a sambalatintechno producer straight after hearing it.

[The Overfiend]

Its all about the Code Red series if we are talking influential. as in Label & Stuff Beyer released. That Sim Remanipulated remix shouldnt come into the fray unless you suddenly became a sambalatintechno producer straight after hearing it.

but he didnt invent or revolutionize anything with that, anyone can take a celia cruz sample and make it big, i hate that people sample that stuff and end up with a nonsensical spanish quote.

[massplanck]

thats what i was implying.

Adam Beyer influenced me when I heard the code red series. Other people started influencing me after that....

[SlavikSvensk]

okay...i'll stop beating around the bush. i think he has been influential in the sense of popularizing (within the techno community) big-production, sample-based drum tracks. he was not the first, nor the last. his best stuff, IMO, is melodic and generally overlooked. but some of his percussive records (code red 6...i believe co-written with marco corola), safety sessions (co-written with joel mull) and others, were huge. but his style has been mimicked ad naseum!

for better or for worse, techno is where it is now in large part because of him (and, of course, some others).

what i want to also know is why he had so much influence...

...why more than, say, cari lekebusch, who was probably about as popular in 1997 as he was...?

[BRADLEE]

He's been the man for a long time. Many of great tunes have comes form his hands and the whole DC imprint was probably one of the most sucessful techno labels ever. So I'd have to say he's played a pretty big role in the game.

However times change and eventually the torch has to get passed to someone else. So, Who's it going to be :eh: :?: :?: :?:

[Adverse]

"How important is Adam Beyer to techno?" i would say not important enough to have even made this ( :doh: ) lame assed thread. beyer ain't originate shit, he just gave that mass produced, ikea feel to the raw shit glenn already had going imo.

seriously. :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: beat me to it.

[SlavikSvensk]

:hmm:

well, you are entitled to your opinion, but that's not really what i was trying to get at with this thread. i'd rather talk about why he has been influential, and what that has meant for techno, rather than argue about whether he a) rules or b) sucks. i'm sure that's been done elsewhere to fascinating effect...

[The Overfiend]

mastered the art of compression................

[lau]

mastered the art of compression................

hmmzz I heard loads of his first records were mixed in the studio of carola by carola.....

So actually you like carola.. :lol:

(never can be sure about the rumours though.. :roll: )

[TechMouse]

Same as Conflict was saying - it was Adam Beyer stuff that realy got me into Techno, so I have to respect it on that level.

Plus, I keep digging out old Drumcode records and remarking on how good they sound.

... and his remix of Woodcarver is quality.

Also, picked up a couple of relatively new Beyer tunes - one on Mad Eye, I think? - which are very good. Especially, the glitchy skippy stuff.

Biggest selling artist in Techno anyway, or at least certainly was at one point.

[geraldo]

I thank him for putting this out : beast tamer volume 01

[Adverse]

mastered the art of compression................

compression isn't really an art and if it is (or at least if people think it is)... we're all in big trouble. i mean setting a high ratio, pushing the gain and slapping a fast attack on a bass line or lower mids isn't anything praiseworthy (i'd rate a final mixdown and equalization much higher than compression. anyways the real compressing really goes down at the cut imo). these are things one would think you should know before even setting your ideas to the canvas. post has nothing to do with pre imo. so many times i've heard people post produce their track before the the pre production has even been scrutinized.

back to the topic.. to me adam made some really good tracks (conform 12 anyone?)...and has proven diverse in influence and as far as dj'ing goes he's definitely one to check out. whether he deserves exaltation.. eh i'm not so sure. he gets respect any how.

[gunjack]

mastered the art of compression................


pffft, let him master the art of de compression. ;)

[SlavikSvensk]

mastered the art of compression................

compression isn't really an art and if it is (or at least if people think it is)... we're all in big trouble. i mean setting a high ratio, pushing the gain and slapping a fast attack on a bass line or lower mids isn't anything praiseworthy (i'd rate a final mixdown and equalization much higher than compression. anyways the real compressing really goes down at the cut imo). these are things one would think you should know before even setting your ideas to the canvas. post has nothing to do with pre imo. so many times i've heard people post produce their track before the the pre production has even been scrutinized.

back to the topic.. to me adam made some really good tracks (conform 12 anyone?)...and has proven diverse in influence and as far as dj'ing goes he's definitely one to check out. whether he deserves exaltation.. eh i'm not so sure. he gets respect any how.

true, true. compressing samples isn't exactly rocket science.

but that uber-compressed sound is, i think, part of the reason he got so big, and why he has been imitated so much... has to do with the size of the sounds. there were plenty of good percussive techno tracks out there before drumcode, but adam (and others on planet rhythm) seemed to make bigger tracks.

probably some of this also has to do with all this coinciding with vst software technology...putting certain sound processing tools in the hands of people who might not have been able to afford it before...so more people actually had the ability to imitate it than before...

[dirty_bass]

mastered the art of compression................

compression isn't really an art and if it is (or at least if people think it is)... we're all in big trouble. i mean setting a high ratio, pushing the gain and slapping a fast attack on a bass line or lower mids isn't anything praiseworthy (i'd rate a final mixdown and equalization much higher than compression. anyways the real compressing really goes down at the cut imo). these are things one would think you should know before even setting your ideas to the canvas. post has nothing to do with pre imo. so many times i've heard people post produce their track before the the pre production has even been scrutinized.

back to the topic.. to me adam made some really good tracks (conform 12 anyone?)...and has proven diverse in influence and as far as dj'ing goes he's definitely one to check out. whether he deserves exaltation.. eh i'm not so sure. he gets respect any how.

dude, I hate to point a finger at you, but if that`s all you think compression is, then you don`t knbow much about it.

[Sunil]

"How important is Adam Beyer to techno?" i would say not important enough to have even made this ( :doh: ) lame assed thread. beyer ain't originate shit, he just gave that mass produced, ikea feel to the raw shit glenn already had going imo.

Jesus man, that's almost the most stupid post I've read by you so far. Adam Beyer is massively important to techno, far more so than you'll ever be that's for sure.

[Adverse]

mastered the art of compression................

compression isn't really an art and if it is (or at least if people think it is)... we're all in big trouble. i mean setting a high ratio, pushing the gain and slapping a fast attack on a bass line or lower mids isn't anything praiseworthy (i'd rate a final mixdown and equalization much higher than compression. anyways the real compressing really goes down at the cut imo). these are things one would think you should know before even setting your ideas to the canvas. post has nothing to do with pre imo. so many times i've heard people post produce their track before the the pre production has even been scrutinized.

back to the topic.. to me adam made some really good tracks (conform 12 anyone?)...and has proven diverse in influence and as far as dj'ing goes he's definitely one to check out. whether he deserves exaltation.. eh i'm not so sure. he gets respect any how.

dude, I hate to point a finger at you, but if that`s all you think compression is, then you don`t knbow much about it.


do you want me to go into what i know then? in a thread about adam beyer? please.

[loopdon]

"How important is Adam Beyer to techno?" i would say not important enough to have even made this ( :doh: ) lame assed thread. beyer ain't originate shit, he just gave that mass produced, ikea feel to the raw shit glenn already had going imo.

Jesus man, that's almost the most stupid post I've read by you so far. Adam Beyer is massively important to techno, far more so than you'll ever be that's for sure.

let's just wait and see, ok, don't want to feel sorry later on, do we? ;)

[gunjack]

pffft sunil you go on with the importance of adam beyer, iw ill go back to my ornette coleman.

[dirty_bass]

It`s all about exposure. Beyer did a lot to expose more people to techno.
Without people like him, commercial or whatever, techno would be a very small and sad club of moaning losers.

[Sunil]

pffft sunil you go on with the importance of adam beyer, iw ill go back to my ornette coleman.

You listen to jazz?! :notworthy: Holy ****, you must be right about Beyer then.

[SlavikSvensk]

ornette coleman invented hard techno... :wicked:

[Stella Boy]

It`s all about exposure. Beyer did a lot to expose more people to techno.
Without people like him, commercial or whatever, techno would be a very small and sad club of moaning losers.

How did he ? If you weren't in a techno club then you didn't hear techno ( unless the EM had a VERY rare set by a techno dj ). Sure, his tunes stood out at that time ( but so did MANY others) but I wouldn't say it exposed the sound to non -techno fans - Techno as a whole in that era exposed alot of people to techno because the clubs were ALWAYS full with people wanting to know what the fuss was about. As much as it grates on me to say it, i'd say Fergie has brought more exposure to the techno scene than Beyer.

As for techno being a small and sad club of moaning losers , I can't actually believe someone like yourself would say this :dontevengothere:

[dirty_bass]

If I remember correctly, there used to be a sea of people who`d walk into record shops because they heard Beyer. He popularised the new era of techno, I`m not saying he`s great, but to not acknowledge the effect, in terms of pull and awareness, is a little naieve.
He was one of the Top Top names in techno for ages, and obviously anyone in this position has influence.

[Tyrisia]

I rate other people more, but I like most of what I've heard of him

[dirty_bass]

It`s all about exposure. Beyer did a lot to expose more people to techno.
Without people like him, commercial or whatever, techno would be a very small and sad club of moaning losers.

How did he ? If you weren't in a techno club then you didn't hear techno ( unless the EM had a VERY rare set by a techno dj ). Sure, his tunes stood out at that time ( but so did MANY others) but I wouldn't say it exposed the sound to non -techno fans - Techno as a whole in that era exposed alot of people to techno because the clubs were ALWAYS full with people wanting to know what the fuss was about. As much as it grates on me to say it, i'd say Fergie has brought more exposure to the techno scene than Beyer.

As for techno being a small and sad club of moaning losers , I can't actually believe someone like yourself would say this :dontevengothere:

It`s true. The swedish explosion had a knock on effect for everyone. The popularisation of techno meant that there were more clubs and in effect more gigs, etc. So really without it people that create (an albeit commercial?) buzz, it really does help us all, in a way.
Otherwise, if it was all overly contemplative, nihilistic, nerds (like myself) then it wouldn`t be the scene it was at it`s height.
Admittedly it did collapse in on itself, but only really because of the sea of imitators.

[gunjack]

pffft sunil you go on with the importance of adam beyer, iw ill go back to my ornette coleman.

You listen to jazz?! :notworthy: Holy ****, you must be right about Beyer then.


thank you.

[dirty_bass]

I think your all gay, for only I am the true master, as I listen to, and fully appreciate and understand the fabulous breathing sounds of Bob Anal in his iron lung, and the remixes done by none other than Slip Digby where he reduces the entire 54 song catalogue of Bobs discography into one succint 0.13 second re-interpretation that is essentially the beginning of a fart produced by a very rare Patagonian dung warbler Yak, carefully compressed in a 54 stage hand wound mangle.

Therefore.

I am right.



























Puny humans.

[SlavikSvensk]

bob anal f***ing rocks! he invented jeff mills!

[BRADLEE]

think your all gay, for only I am the true master, as I listen to, and fully appreciate and understand the fabulous breathing sounds of Bob Anal in his iron lung, and the remixes done by none other than Slip Digby where he reduces the entire 54 song catalogue of Bobs discography into one succint 0.13 second re-interpretation that is essentially the beginning of a fart produced by a very rare Patagonian dung warbler Yak, carefully compressed in a 54 stage hand wound mangle.

Therefore.

I am right.



























Puny humans.

:notworthy:

[dirty_bass]

bob anal f***ing rocks! he invented jeff mills!

Yes, using nothing other than trained eyelid muscle control, and 3 years worth of eyebrow dandruff collected in his tearduct.

[SlavikSvensk]

bob anal f***ing rocks! he invented jeff mills!

Yes, using nothing other than trained eyelid muscle control, and 3 years worth of eyebrow dandruff collected in his tearduct.

and, of course, the leftover nails and woodscrews from his IKEA furniture!

[ds2]

It`s true. The swedish explosion had a knock on effect for everyone. The popularisation of techno meant that there were more clubs and in effect more gigs, etc. So really without it people that create (an albeit commercial?) buzz, it really does help us all, in a way.
Otherwise, if it was all overly contemplative, nihilistic, nerds (like myself) then it wouldn`t be the scene it was at it`s height.
Admittedly it did collapse in on itself, but only really because of the sea of imitators.

the popularisation of techno?
sorry but that's the biggest load of bollocks i've ever read. so you're saying techno wasn't "popular" before sweden? give me a break. :roll:

techno never collapsed on itself either, it's still here struggling along like all vinyl based musics. clubwise, in the north at least, there's more nights and more choice than ever.

[dirty_bass]

So your saying that beyer records never sold like hot cakes, and all the kids didn`t talk about him all the time.
It used to be you`d get tech freaks flooding into shops and they`d always ask for the new beyer record.
They wouldn`t even listen to anything else.
Like him or not, he had an influence, and you can`t deny it.

That`s like me saying Jeff Mills had no influence in techno, just because I consider his music irrelevant (which I do) and boring twoddle (which I also do).
However, like it or not, he has had an influence.

[Heroes]

id say frankfurt commercialized techno, the stockholm movement probably popularised it more but absolutly not in a comercial way, prime did that on there own cutting deals to get it stocked in tescos probably..... what stockholm did was a real breath of fresh air for the scene, tell me what capital or city of less than 1 million can say the same........

[ds2]

So your saying that beyer records never sold like hot cakes, and all the kids didn`t talk about him all the time.
It used to be you`d get tech freaks flooding into shops and they`d always ask for the new beyer record.
They wouldn`t even listen to anything else.
Like him or not, he had an influence, and you can`t deny it.

That`s like me saying Jeff Mills had no influence in techno, just because I consider his music irrelevant (which I do) and boring twoddle (which I also do).
However, like it or not, he has had an influence.

i never said anything of the sort. i said your comment about beyer being responsible for the popularisation of techno was a load of bollocks which it was. techno clubs were rammed for years before sweden came along. techno records sold like hot cakes for years before beyer came along.

you consider mills irrelevant, big deal. that's totally your loss mate but how anyone can call waveforms, punisher, mecca, other day, growth, x102, extremist etc "boring twoddle" while claiming to be into techno is totally beyond me.

[Numeric]

you consider mills irrelevant, big deal. that's totally your loss mate but how anyone can call waveforms, punisher, mecca, other day, growth, x102, extremist etc "boring twoddle" while claiming to be into techno is totally beyond me.

:clap:

[ds2]

id say frankfurt commercialized techno, the stockholm movement probably popularised it more but absolutly not in a comercial way, prime did that on there own cutting deals to get it stocked in tescos probably..... what stockholm did was a real breath of fresh air for the scene, tell me what capital or city of less than 1 million can say the same........

spot on.

frankfurt was great at first and did a hell of a lot to popularise techno in the uk and europe but too many records over too little time really killed it off before the likes of paul van dyke and crew took over.

those early swedish 12s on planet rhythm are still big favourites and remain as the few beyer records i own to this day. although cari lekebusch was king of sweden back then.

[Heroes]

i think beyer has been important to the scene, as is lekebusch too, but like you said there has been many before, djax had a healthy catalog at the birth of beyers releases consisting of the arly works of clementine, mills ha d the waveforms thing going on whoooooheeee yea man killa stuff, plus mad mike had his submerge mob banging out mental shit, r&s was exposing there side, beltram was knockin up some mad shit too. but all i mentioned had different styles for sure....

[SlavikSvensk]

id say frankfurt commercialized techno, the stockholm movement probably popularised it more but absolutly not in a comercial way, prime did that on there own cutting deals to get it stocked in tescos probably..... what stockholm did was a real breath of fresh air for the scene, tell me what capital or city of less than 1 million can say the same........

spot on. the man knows of what he speaks!

besides, the stockholm group was a pretty diverse group back then. and most of the tracks coming out of there were not drumcode style. not sure if people remember cari's mr. barth project on svek, but the two albums--and the two singles with alexi delano--were really, really different...slower and much weirder, but still "big" sounding...and still among my favorites today. there were other labels like lask, loop, plumphouse, borft, etc. that also put out some quality tunes that sounded absolutely 0.000000000 % like drumcode.

[dirty_bass]

you consider mills irrelevant, big deal. that's totally your loss mate but how anyone can call waveforms, punisher, mecca, other day, growth, x102, extremist etc "boring twoddle" while claiming to be into techno is totally beyond me.

See, there`s my point. I don`t like mills at all, and you do, your argument about beyer is the same as mine about mills.
It`s an issue of taste (although I am not a fan of either)
You don`t have to like mills to be into techno, jesus, get a grip.
To me, mills sucks, and makes boring bleepy rubbish, to you, maybe Innigo Kennedy sucks, or whatever, it doesn`t mean either of us isn`t into techno.


Back in topic.
How important is beyer to techno?
Well, these days, maybe not so important.
But a few years ago, he got a lot of people raving about it, he filled the clubs, got on radio one, sold a lot of records, and was at the centre of a new sound, which at the time was pretty fresh.
So historically I would say he is fairly important.
Not that anyone is any more important than anyone else anyway.

[Sunil]

That`s like me saying Jeff Mills had no influence in techno, just because I consider his music irrelevant (which I do) and boring twoddle (which I also do).
However, like it or not, he has had an influence.

Irrelevant? :eh: Don't be ignorant just because you want to have a different opinion to everyone else ;)
Mills sure has made a lot of average stuff, but he's a pioneer. And you talk a lot about Inigo Kennedy, A LOT of his material is Mills influenced.

As a matter of interest, what techno do you like? Anyone that hasn't made it 'big' ?

[ds2]

See, there`s my point. I don`t like mills at all, and you do, your argument about beyer is the same as mine about mills.
It`s an issue of taste (although I am not a fan of either)
You don`t have to like mills to be into techno, jesus, get a grip.
To me, mills sucks, and makes boring bleepy rubbish, to you, maybe Innigo Kennedy sucks, or whatever, it doesn`t mean either of us isn`t into techno.


no, i think inigo is shit hot, he played for us 3 months ago..

and no, you don't have to like mills to be into techno but calling his stuff boring bleep rubbish, well that to me sounds you've picked up on mills' later stuff and written him off which tells it's own story.

my argument about beyer is totally different. you said he popularised techno, i said you're talking bollocks. i never once said i don't like his records.

[dirty_bass]

Irrelevant? :eh: Don't be ignorant just because you want to have a different opinion to everyone else ;)




I find your comment more ignorant, because it`s based on an an assumption.
I consider him to be irrelevant. It doesn`t mean he isn`t relevant.
Irrelevant to ME
That`s not ignorance.
He simply has no relevance to me.
I didn`t get into techno via him at all.
I`ve heard his stuff from way back to now and I don`t like it.
It`s purely that.
I don`t like it.
Sorry if this is a shock to you, but I can`t stand mills music.
Doesn`t mean he isn`t relevant to other people.
Is it some kind of techno passport.
You can`t like techno unless you acknowledge mills
:dontevengothere:

[ds2]

I didn`t get into techno via him at all.

neither did i.

how did you then?

[dirty_bass]

I got into techno via industrial then ebm (breakdance and electro somehwere along the way) then free party stuff, then techno. I`ve not always been a fan of techno, I haven`t followed it since I was a lad or anything, I tend to move on to a new style every 3 or so years. Although I seem to have lingered on techno for longer than that.

[Sunil]

Irrelevant? :eh: Don't be ignorant just because you want to have a different opinion to everyone else ;)




I find your comment more ignorant, because it`s based on an an assumption.
I consider him to be irrelevant. It doesn`t mean he isn`t relevant.
Irrelevant to ME
That`s not ignorance.
He simply has no relevance to me.
I didn`t get into techno via him at all.
I`ve heard his stuff from way back to now and I don`t like it.
It`s purely that.
I don`t like it.
Sorry if this is a shock to you, but I can`t stand mills music.
Doesn`t mean he isn`t relevant to other people.
Is it some kind of techno passport.
You can`t like techno unless you acknowledge mills
:dontevengothere:

You may not have got into techno via him, but the use of 'irrelevant' whatever way you meant it is just daft. Have you ever been in a club when "Step To Enchantment" got played, when "Seawolf" was tearing the system apart or when even "The Bells" was being lapped up countless times in the one night? He may do some run of the Mills stuff, sure, I won't disagree there... for someone who prides themselves on their open mindedness I often think you are anything but, otherwise you might have better words to say abouts the Mills', Beyers, Beltrams, Surgeons who get few kudos from you. How about getting familar with some of these people's catalogues? I'm not saying you have to like these people or need to have them in your blood to be 'techno', I just think some of your outlook or opinions on important producers suggest that you aren't familar with too much of their good material.

[ds2]

I consider him to be irrelevant. It doesn`t mean he isn`t relevant.
Irrelevant to ME
That`s not ignorance.
He simply has no relevance to me.
I didn`t get into techno via him at all.


so who did you get into that pulled you away from free party scene and into the purer techno? who's relevant to you?

i'm genuinely interested.

[dirty_bass]

I am, I just don`t like them
Never really liked any beltram.
Never really liked any mills.
Heard plenty.
I`ve not dissed Beyer in any way, so you`ve not been reading what I`ve read. I liked the safety sessions stuff with mull, and the album on drumcode beyer did(forgotten what it was called)
I`ve got plenty of surgeon however, and like a lot of his stuff.
It`s called taste.
I am open minded, and listen to loads and loads of music.
I simply don`t like much of the old techno heroes like mills or beltram.
And it`s not Daft. It`s not relevant to me. Does that make sense? it`s very simple.
In the same way that Boyd Rice, Monte Cazzazza, Coum Transmissions, and SPK may not be relevant to you.
I certianly won`t call you daft for it.

[ds2]

I am open minded, and listen to loads and loads of music.
I simply don`t like much of the old techno heroes like mills or beltram.
And it`s not Daft. It`s not relevant to me. Does that make sense? it`s very simple..

makes perfect sense. you're very open minded until it comes to listening to any kind of techno that was made before you got into it a few years ago.

old techno = irrelevant ?????
very open minded.

[Sunil]

I am, I just don`t like them
Never really liked any beltram.
Never really liked any mills.
Heard plenty.
I`ve not dissed Beyer in any way, so you`ve not been reading what I`ve read. I liked the safety sessions stuff with mull, and the album on drumcode beyer did(forgotten what it was called)
I`ve got plenty of surgeon however, and like a lot of his stuff.
It`s called taste.
I am open minded, and listen to loads and loads of music.
I simply don`t like much of the old techno heroes like mills or beltram.
And it`s not Daft. It`s not relevant to me. Does that make sense? it`s very simple.
In the same way that Boyd Rice, Monte Cazzazza, Coum Transmissions, and SPK may not be relevant to you.
I certianly won`t call you daft for it.

I take your point. "Irrelevant" he may well be in your path to techno, I find it hard to believe how someone into techno may not have been moved by *something* Mills has done? Again, I feel there's stuff you haven't heard or given a chance, I really do.

I thought you said you weren't a fan of Beyer earlier in this thread? That's the kind of thing that made me wonder what you do actually like.

You're entitled not to like the old heroes, but I think you're way too offhand in your analysis of some producers . It's kind of funny when you can give details of what you don't like about a new techno 12", yet when it comes to some of the bigger, long serving established artists, you just say "Not my thing, don't like it", and that's it.

[SlavikSvensk]

I am open minded, and listen to loads and loads of music.
I simply don`t like much of the old techno heroes like mills or beltram.
And it`s not Daft. It`s not relevant to me. Does that make sense? it`s very simple..

makes perfect sense. you're very open minded until it comes to listening to any kind of techno that was made before you got into it a few years ago.

old techno = irrelevant ?????
very open minded.

hmm...well...saying you don't particularly care for some of the old heroes is one thing, and saying they are "irrelevant" to techno is another. but i'm pretty sure that dirtybass means is closer to the first than the second. i'm just basing that on past conversations and also what was said earlier in this thread about adam beyer. as in "i don't sit around listening to ballpark and reverting and get inspired by them to make my own music." i'm pretty sure he's not saying "jeff mills and joey beltram are irrelevant to where techno is today."

am i right, steve? wrong?

[dirty_bass]

Ok, l;et me simplify.
TO ME they are not irrelevant, how hard is it to understand that. they are not relevant to ME. It`s got nothing to do with being open minded. I understand how relevant they are to others. But they are not, to me.

I acknowledge that mills etc had an effect or whatever, so of course they are relevant in the history of techno.
And the fact I don`t like them has nothing to do with the fact they were before I got into techno.
I JUST DON`T LIKE THEIR MUSIC
Do you really want me to break down why I don`t like it?
I`ll get flamed even more if I do, so I`d rather not.
I`m not a fan of Beyer, but I still have some of his co productions with mull, which I think are ok, and a few of the tracks off of the drumcode album (the old one with the girders on the cover). I`m not a fan of Ben stiller, but I`ve seen a few films he`s in.
Aaaaanyway.
the point I was making, is that people were kinda jumping on the relevance of Beyer to techno as a whole, purely down to whether they liked his music or whatever. So it was an issue of taste. The fact is, is that he did make a big contribution, as did Mills.

Whether or not I like any of them and if they are relevant to me personally, really makes no odds does it?
Or have I failed as a techno person now because I don`t like some old dudes who made some stuff ages ago that I don`t like.

I tell you what, I really don`t like Beethoven either.
Am I even worse now?

[dan the acid man]

you've got to pay respect to these people, whether you like their music or not, plain and simple

[ds2]

I JUST DON`T LIKE THEIR MUSIC
Do you really want me to break down why I don`t like it?


yes, because..


You can be "negative" about stuff, but just explain yourself intelligently.
Saying.
Dude, that new ***** record, is wank innit.

Is just pointless

you made the rules....

[fitipaldi]

I JUST DON`T LIKE THEIR MUSIC
Do you really want me to break down why I don`t like it?


yes, because..


You can be "negative" about stuff, but just explain yourself intelligently.
Saying.
Dude, that new ***** record, is wank innit.

Is just pointless

you made the rules....

:lol:

[dirty_bass]

Saying I don`t like it, isn`t negative.

Saying it`s rubbish without explanation is.
Which I didn`t do.
I simply don`t like it.

I guess I did say I found mills stuff boring. Which I do.
I guess it`s the use of very similar sounds a lot of the time. Constant reliance on 909. And just, well, it doesn`t move me.
Production is fine though.

As for Beltram, I just don`t like the old sound he had.
It sounds too old and too simple. And his new stuff just annoys me as I really don`t like Disco Techno, that is very very loopy.

Satisfied?

[dirty_bass]

I can`t believe dummies are being spit over matters of taste.
I`ve got no problem with the oldies production, nor do I think they are crap.
Just don`t like em.

Hey, I don`t like Mars Volta, or Metallica. Anyone else wanna spit a dummy?

[SlavikSvensk]

you've got to pay respect to these people, whether you like their music or not, plain and simple

:clap: :clap: :clap:

...though i'm pretty sure we all are, on some level or another...

[SlavikSvensk]

...besides...when did this thread become another jeff mills argument?

[SlavikSvensk]

...i love it when we talk about jeff mills...

:bash: :bash: :bash:

[dirty_bass]

hehe, yeah, it has gone a bit off topic, and it`s not helping my caffeine withdrawel at all.

[SlavikSvensk]

...nor my combination of migraine and self-pity that i'm not in detroit for DEMF right now...

[SlavikSvensk]

...you should lock this thread so i can start a new one called "so the adam beyer thread got locked..."

:lol:

[SlavikSvensk]

woops! need sam for that one (forgot where i was, i did)...

[dan the acid man]

woops! need sam for that one (forgot where i was, i did)...

your starting to talk like your avatar now :lol:

[SlavikSvensk]

woops! need sam for that one (forgot where i was, i did)...

your starting to talk like your avatar now :lol:

:)

think of importance of jeff mills and adam beyer, i do

[dirty_bass]

Think of the importance of Bob Moog.
It`s all down to him
http://www.mkv.mh.se/staff/per/sas/bob_moog.gif

[ds2]

you still never answered my question though db.
mills, beltram and co are irrelevant to you, fair enough. so who is relevant? who inspired you?

[dan the acid man]

the force is strong in them :lol: :oops:

[SlavikSvensk]

you still never answered my question though db.
mills, beltram and co are irrelevant to you, fair enough. so who is relevant? who inspired you?

i kindly refer you back to page 4 of this thread.

there, you will find answers to many questions, including the origin of jeff mills...

[dirty_bass]

I was inspired by Monte Cazzazza. SPK. TG. Ministry. Franz Treichler. Boyd Rice. Z`ev. A lot of early breakdance/hiphop/electro. Most of the early Cleopatra stuff. William Burroughs and Bryon Gysin
Arvo Part, Underworld, John Roome, Aphex, Robin Proper Shephard, Dan Zamani, the list is endless, I`m constantly inspired by music, always have and always will be, but not from any particular source.

[SlavikSvensk]

...and bob anal, of course...

[dirty_bass]

obviously
lets not forget bob flanagan too, he was an all american hero

[ds2]

I was inspired by Monte Cazzazza. SPK. TG. Ministry. Franz Treichler. Boyd Rice. Z`ev. A lot of early breakdance/hiphop/electro. Most of the early Cleopatra stuff. William Burroughs and Bryon Gysin
Arvo Part, Underworld, John Roome, Aphex, Robin Proper Shephard, Dan Zamani, the list is endless, I`m constantly inspired by music, always have and always will be, but not from any particular source.

since you're avoiding it like the plague i'll ask another way. if you're playing a techno set in a club/squat who's records are in your box ?

[dirty_bass]

I don`t mix very much any more.
But I guess, anything I like.
I don`t mix one sub sub sub genre.
I tend to play all sorts.
Just looking next to me here at a stack of records, there is Stoll, Seb Marx, Gecko, Mark Brom, Innigo Kennedy, Smoothraxx, Samuel Onervas, Ade Fenton, Jark Prongo, Surgeon, SLS, Zank, PWOG, Kode IV, Varela, Andreas Kauffelt, Luciano and Quenum, and I`ll stop now.
I play music I like and don`t devote myself to one artist.
Don`t see how relevant this is though.

[ds2]

devotion to one artist is bad. i certainly ain't devoted to mills if that's what you're getting at. not bought one of his records in about 2 years and last time i saw him spin i left half way through.

but with that list you've just proved exactly what i knew all along. ;)

[dirty_bass]

Which is what, that they are the records that are on the floor to the left of me?

[dirty_bass]

If you think you can make a judgment based on that then well done, you must be psychic.

[SlavikSvensk]

jark prongo is cool.

[eyes without a face]

Which is what, that they are the records that are on the floor to the left of me?

haha sorry but thats a good comeback :lol:

[ds2]

yeah hilarious comeback.

ok so you love inigo kennedy, sls, steve stoll and ade fenton yet you think the music of the guy who was a major influence on them is boring bleepy twoddle. :roll:

i mean ffs sam session made his name by copying the purpose maker back cat. inigo has stated in countless interviews over the years how mills was such an influence in his sound and is proud that millsy plays his records. steve stoll's always been a part of that hood, mills, beltram thing. you also say you have loads of surgeon tracks. well **** me, most of surgeon's early work could've been mistaken for mills and often was in the clubs...

sunil called you daft, well to say you like and play out the music of those above yet have never liked one single mills track is beyond daft.

no i'm not a mills devotee in anyway and have never bothered with these "is mills any good" type debates before. this one was different as it was all aobut one person purposely attempting to be controversial and trying to prove that "i'm different......man"

i've not bought a mills track in about 3 years and last time i went to see him spin i ended up in the backroom cos he was having one of those off nights he seems to be having more and more of these days.

[ds2]

can't believe i just fell for that but **** it, it gave me something to do last night while babysitting the chicken pox clan.

pub ====>

[dirty_bass]

can't believe i just fell for that but **** it, it gave me something to do last night while babysitting the chicken pox clan.

pub ====>

I`m not trying to prove anything man.
And I`m not trying to be controversial, I`m just saying how it is, as I always do, and you jumping around making accusations like some kid in a schoolyard.
The fact is I don`t like mills.
Can`t you get it.
I don`t care who influenced who, cos if you go down that sad path you can keep tracing back and tracing back till you reach the first caveman who hit a hollow log.

What you don`t understand is that I don`t like mills tracks. I don`t like any of the early surgeon stuff that sounds like mills tracks.
As for stoll, I don`t like much of his stuff, he is totally, 1 blinding track for every 10 boring twoddly ones.
Your making assumptions based on a little pile of records that were on the floor next to my chair.
How daft is that?


so once more for the deaf.

I
Don`t
Like
Mills
Music

He`s not crap, nor have I called him crap, I haven`t said his music is crap, or the people who like his music, or even his bloody axis beach shoes.
Yes he was an early techno person, and ws there at the beginning, and I acknowledge his importance to many people in techno, but in turn he was influenced as well, so what, big deal. Every time I look at my watch do I have to acccept and acknowldge the inventor of the quartz crystal timing unit
:dontevengothere:

[ds2]

I`m not trying to prove anything man.
And I`m not trying to be controversial,


yes you are, just like most posts you make are trying to be controversial.



I
Don`t
Like
Mills
Music

:

no, you just like music that sounds like his....

that's it for me with this one.
banging my head against a wall.

[dirty_bass]

I don`t try to be anything.
If you think I am trying to be controversial, then fantastic, a false opinion, great, give yourself a biscuit.
I guess I`ve smashed you world by not liking any mills tracks.
And none of the stuff I like sounds like mills.
HOW DO YOU KNOW
have you been secretly sneaking into my studio and listening to my record collection.
No
You make this assumption based on some names on some records, and you don`t even know the track names.
How misinformed is this?
I have plenty of mills stuff, and I just don`t like it, or any of the stuff that sounds like it, so just understand it.
It`s very simple.

[dirty_bass]

Lemme just check
Slice of life ep - steve stoll - nothing like mills
Jark Prongo - radio Show - Nothing like Mills
Seb Marx GW002 - Nothing Like Mills
Marco Lenzi - Who Cares 001 - Nothing Like Mills
Smoothraxx - Followed by the past - nothing like mills
drumbeaters - white night remixes - nothin glike mills
animal workshop remixes - nothin glike mills
Daze maxim - grown on a magnet - nothing like mills

Well chief, you really got me there.
All my records sound like mills.
I`m off to kill myself.

[ds2]

quite a selective list there considering your earlier post mentioned..



Mark Broom, Inigo Kennedy, Samuel Onervas, Ade Fenton, Surgeon, SLS, Zank,

i'd love to know which axis records it is you own that you hate so much too. surely if you bought them...

[loopdon]

ffs sake! i respect dirty_bass opinion a 100 %. if he doesn't like a mills track (mmh, i know where you are comng from), then that's it. why waffle around for hours???????

this is so stupid. just because someone says he has been influenced by mills, and i like this artist's stuff doesn't mean i have to like mills' tracks, do i? of course i could say i have been influenced by beyer, whoever, but do people listening to tracks of mine have to like beyer because of that????

and: influenced means influenced, not copied 1:1 or anything, i might have even been influenced by elvis, who knows... and... does it really matter??? would it matter if i was big in techno (whatever that is?)??

sorry, i'm drunk but this endless rambling here is really getting on my nerves at times.

mills def. has done a lot for the scene, i reckon, and it's a fact, but there's no denying he has gotten away with stuff (be it djing or producing) for which "newborn" producers would get torn to pieces and i am not only referring to older material.

[loopdon]

ffs sake! i respect dirty_bass opinion a 100 %. if he doesn't like a mills track (mmh, i know where you are comng from), then that's it. why waffle around for hours???????

this is so stupid. just because someone says he has been influenced by mills, and i like this artist's stuff doesn't mean i have to like mills' tracks, do i? of course i could say i have been influenced by beyer, whoever, but do people listening to tracks of mine have to like beyer because of that????

and: influenced means influenced, not copied 1:1 or anything, i might have even been influenced by elvis, who knows... and... does it really matter??? would it matter if i was big in techno (whatever that is?)??

sorry, i'm drunk but this endless rambling here is really getting on my nerves at times.

mills def. has done a lot for the scene, i reckon, and it's a fact, but there's no denying he has gotten away with stuff (be it djing or producing) for which "newborn" producers would get torn to pieces and i am not only referring to older material.


shall we get back to beyer the, after all??? ;) ;) ;)

[SlavikSvensk]

yeah, time to move on!

back to the non-confrontational subject of adam beyer ;)

[ds2]

don't get me started on that dumb ass "beyer popularising techno" comment again, forgot about that. that's what originally made me post :lol:

just had a bollocking from the missus for playing games, drinking too much and waffling all day on here so i better make her dinner. :oops:

[SlavikSvensk]

i think whether you like him or not, adam beyer was a huge influence on what techno is today. sort of like what you were saying about jeff mills...though in a very different (and probably less fundamental) way...

[Sunil]

ffs sake! i respect dirty_bass opinion a 100 %. if he doesn't like a mills track (mmh, i know where you are comng from), then that's it. why waffle around for hours???????



There was an investigation going on. Sometimes these things take a bit of time ;)

A funny twist or two in this, and I'm still not convinced either. I thought Stoll was "the man" as far as you were concerned Dirty, now you don't like much of his stuff. Earlier in this thread you weren't a fan of Beyer, but suddenly you could name a number of records you liked by him. By this rational there are records of Mills' that you like. I don't believe that there aren't *any* out there, sorry.

[Mindful]

I personaly like Beyer and love Drumcode he has influenced me quite alot and I think him and the rest of the Swedish boys have done there part for techno.
I will allways listen to his new stuff but rarley buy it.I like his dark breakey stuff and the loopy stuff but not too much of a fan of his latest releases to be honest.

All in all I think the Swedish techno sound is good club techno and if im playing out there is allways at least one of his records in my bag infact ive hammerd the shit out Kosheen on the Beyer and Hennrik B double on Drumcode.

So nothing but respect for the man from me.

[Sunil]

I personaly like Beyer and love Drumcode he has influenced me quite alot and I think him and the rest of the Swedish boys have done there part for techno.
I will allways listen to his new stuff but rarley buy it.I like his dark breakey stuff and the loopy stuff but not too much of a fan of his latest releases to be honest.

All in all I think the Swedish techno sound is good club techno and if im playing out there is allways at least one of his records in my bag infact ive hammerd the shit out Kosheen on the Beyer and Hennrik B double on Drumcode.

So nothing but respect for the man from me.

I really like some of the Madeye stuff, not 100% original, but what is these days? It works.

The Truesoul stuff I'm undecided on, the vocals by Robert Manos ruined (in my opinion) what was a strong split 12" from ADJD and Beyer on the new one. I like the fact that the Swedes are trying new things; the vocals on some of their tracks, while working sometimes, come off sounding bad at other times.

[ds2]

There was an investigation going on. Sometimes these things take a bit of time ;)



:lol:

[SlavikSvensk]

I really like some of the Madeye stuff, not 100% original, but what is these days? It works.

The Truesoul stuff I'm undecided on, the vocals by Robert Manos ruined (in my opinion) what was a strong split 12" from ADJD and Beyer on the new one. I like the fact that the Swedes are trying new things; the vocals on some of their tracks, while working sometimes, come off sounding bad at other times.

i like most of what i've heard on truesoul. not for everyone, but i think it's important that poeple try to explore the soulful side of techno in a way that isn't just an homage to detroit...nothing wrong with detroit-style tracks, of course, it's just nice for me to hear more quality melodic techno that is different.

[Joseph Isaac]

well it was his tunes and his labels that got me into techno so obviously i rate the guy

;)

Same here!

[dirty_bass]

ffs sake! i respect dirty_bass opinion a 100 %. if he doesn't like a mills track (mmh, i know where you are comng from), then that's it. why waffle around for hours???????



There was an investigation going on. Sometimes these things take a bit of time ;)

A funny twist or two in this, and I'm still not convinced either. I thought Stoll was "the man" as far as you were concerned Dirty, now you don't like much of his stuff. Earlier in this thread you weren't a fan of Beyer, but suddenly you could name a number of records you liked by him. By this rational there are records of Mills' that you like. I don't believe that there aren't *any* out there, sorry.

Man you people are so black and white.

I have a lot of stoll records.
Most of them were free.
Out of about the 12 or 13 I won.
I like about 4
These 4 are class records.
The rest are pretty poor.
As I said when he is good, he is great, when he sucks, he really sucks.

Or do you people latch onto one artist and just love everything they do regardless of personal taste?

As for beyer. I`m not a fan. But I have a few records with him on.
Do I have to be a fan to own his records?
Or do you have to be a fan and follower of everything you own?

hahaha, I MUST LIKE MILLS

hahahahahaha
sorry, I don`t like anything.
I got mills tracks, and a few albums, but I didn`t pay for them, and I don`t ever listen to them.

Man, you guys rather pathetic attempt at character assassination is actually curing my caffeine withdrawl now. Nice one.

Keep trying.


Next thing you`ll try and convince me that I like Robbie Williams.

[Adverse]

I can`t believe dummies are being spit over matters of taste.
I`ve got no problem with the oldies production, nor do I think they are crap.
Just don`t like em.

Hey, I don`t like Mars Volta, or Metallica. Anyone else wanna spit a dummy?

the ****. whatever. *spit*

[Adverse]

i think whether you like him or not, adam beyer was a huge influence on what techno is today. sort of like what you were saying about jeff mills...though in a very different (and probably less fundamental) way...

techno today.. lol if i influences what techno is today i'd call it a day and book it to india.

[Sunil]

Man, you guys rather pathetic attempt at character assassination is actually curing my caffeine withdrawl now. Nice one.

Keep trying.



If I were a neutral I'd say you've dug a bit of your own hole in this thread, but I'm not, so...

There's no character assasination going on, just a pretty open and frank conversation.

This goes back to you saying Mills is totally irrelevant to you in techno. However you still own records by him. That definitely adds up, doesn't it? Oh, but you won these in a raffle or got them as promos? Ok, I see :roll:

Re: Stoll, he pretty much falls into the Mills mould in that he can or has the capacity to churn it out and his bad tracks will sound weak in comparision to the good ones. Are you trying to tell me that everything Boyd Rice did was great? No, but you still rate him. Likewise I don't bite on everything Stoll does, but I still rate him for the good stuff, and consider myself a fan. That's all we're talking about here. I don't add up the amount of records I've heard by one producer and subtract the ones I didn't like, therefore coming to a negative opinion or judgement on them. You've even started threads about Stoll before raving about him, so stop changing your tune all of a sudden.

If someone's done something worthwhile, be it only a couple of records, then I'd consider them relevant, I wouldn’t say the opposite. I don’t like most of Josh Wink’s output but I still rate him for one or two tracks, so to me I certainly don’t dislike him or consider him irrelevant.

I dunno, the bigger they are the harder they fall. In your case it’s often “The bigger they are, the less respect you pay them”, and that’s pretty shit I have to say.

[dirty_bass]

Well look, I¬m majorly cranky from all the headaches I`m getting having cut out the caffeine.
But I do consider mills irrelevant to me.
Yes, I got a load of promo`s , plus I got gieven a load of techno when my mate got rid of his records.
I don`t like his stuff, and influence wise, he`s not affecting me.
So that`s it.
Not everyone who likes techno likes mills.
Not everyone who likes drum and bass likes roni size.
This is the way of the world.

[ds2]

Man you people are so black and white.
.

unlike your answers to straight forward questions.




sorry, I don`t like anything.
I got mills tracks, and a few albums, but I didn`t pay for them, and I don`t ever listen to them.

Man, you guys rather pathetic attempt at character assassination is actually curing my caffeine withdrawl now. Nice one.

Keep trying.

deary me, stop being paranoid.

so you blagged some free records, well done. do they include seawolf, mecca, drama ep, other day ep, purpose maker 1-5, the waveform albums? have you heard those records?

if you have and still don't like him then fair enough. i'll leave you to your ade fenton, samuel session and caffeine addiction :lol:

[dirty_bass]

mate have you ever had caffeine withdrawl?
I was so tired all week at work I was on 8 or 9 cups of filtered a day
I cut it out this weekend and I have been having psychotic headaches.
I nearly killed a couple of kids behind me today in the cinema during Sith, for talking.

Yes, I have seawolf and drama ep
waveform albums, yikes, don`t get me started on them.
It`s a matter of taste. There`s plenty of stuff I like I`m sure you`ll hate, but I won`t go nuts over it.
Yes, I have a fenton track I like, and also one samuel sessions record.
But you`ll make loads of assumptions and assum I probably buy all their stuff.

I pledge no allegiance to any artist or label.
Whenever I go record shopping, I just ask for all the new stuff, and I go through it all methodically, and buy the stuff I like.
Regardless of name, or whether they are trendy or in favour or whatever

Can we just end this.
I don`t like any mills, and you don`t believe me.
I`m happy with that.

[basslinejunkie]

imo weather you rate him or not (me not being a fan of his work) he has took techno (in whatever shape or form) to a wider audiance,which can only be good for the music,and the scene.

[dirty_bass]

Ahhh but what about beyer.
Obviously opinion here thinks he made contribution to techno at all.

[SlavikSvensk]

.

techno today.. lol if i influences what techno is today i'd call it a day and book it to india.[/quote]

you seem think that i think techno today is great, and this is all due to adam beyer.

not so.

saying he was a huge influence on what techno today is a statement i made devoid of value judgements. as i've said a number of times here, the records by adam beyer that i like are not necessarily the ones that i think have influenced techno.

personally, i think most techno is crap right now, has been for years, and that's something i have said consistantly in my posts on BOA.

that said, i'm not blaming adam beyer himself for this either, and i do like some of his records a lot...that has nothing to do with why this thread is here.

i happen to think that one aspect of his stuff has been picked up on and copied ad nauseum...and i'm curious why that is.

only a few people on the 9 pages here have given intelligent replies to that question

[Sunil]

i happen to think that one aspect of his stuff has been picked up on and copied ad nauseum...and i'm curious why that is.


Drum based techno. More emphasis on the rhythm and grittiness, as opposed to melody and massive hooklines initially, and as that style became more popular, 'bigger' tunes began to appear.. some for the newer converts to techno to latch onto, while still keeping the original fans happy, that's how Beyer elevated above everyone else. While the Drumcode sound was often slated for replaying itself a lot, Beyer did step out of the mould on occasion, on the likes of Svek, Rotation or wherever, next thing you've got Mr.Sliff re-interperting E-Dancer, DC 20.5, "Re-manipulated" remix and the whole Beyer/Drumcode thing has become legendary.

I think also that the sharpness and loudness of Beyer's productions made them attractive for people to mix, and on a 4 track ep for instance, all of the tracks would be instantly mixable. No fade ins, few breaks, and a pretty incessant energy all the way through. When you bought a Beyer or Drumcode style record you knew what to expect, but the difference was he was actually going somewhere with it and managed to make it last for a lot of years. Now you often get a record that in theory is made in the same way, but by a producer who is not truly inspired and is merely putting out something, just to put something out. I have most of the Drumcode releases, and quite a lot of them stand out in their own way.

If I can remember back, the thing that grabbed me most about Beyer's tracks were quite literally, the impact of the kick... as well as the rhythm and swing he applied to it. It was unique.

[SlavikSvensk]

While the Drumcode sound was often slated for replaying itself a lot, Beyer did step out of the mould on occasion, on the likes of Svek, Rotation or wherever, next thing you've got Mr.Sliff re-interperting E-Dancer, DC 20.5, "Re-manipulated" remix and the whole Beyer/Drumcode thing has become legendary.

those records on svek and rotation are, IMO, fantastic.



I think also that the sharpness and loudness of Beyer's productions made them attractive for people to mix, and on a 4 track ep for instance, all of the tracks would be instantly mixable. No fade ins, few breaks, and a pretty incessant energy all the way through. When you bought a Beyer or Drumcode style record you knew what to expect, but the difference was he was actually going somewhere with it and managed to make it last for a lot of years. Now you often get a record that in theory is made in the same way, but by a producer who is not truly inspired and is merely putting out something, just to put something out. I have most of the Drumcode releases, and quite a lot of them stand out in their own way.

If I can remember back, the thing that grabbed me most about Beyer's tracks were quite literally, the impact of the kick... as well as the rhythm and swing he applied to it. It was unique.

:clap: :clap: :clap:

...and i agree...it's the size of the drums...the loudness, the bombast. and it just seems to get more and more so all the time. i like big-sounding kick drums fine...only i don't like the fact that, as you say, this just ends up replacing melody and atmospherics in a lot of today's hard techno.

[Mindful]

i happen to think that one aspect of his stuff has been picked up on and copied ad nauseum...and i'm curious why that is.


Drum based techno. More emphasis on the rhythm and grittiness, as opposed to melody and massive hooklines initially, and as that style became more popular, 'bigger' tunes began to appear.. some for the newer converts to techno to latch onto, while still keeping the original fans happy, that's how Beyer elevated above everyone else. While the Drumcode sound was often slated for replaying itself a lot, Beyer did step out of the mould on occasion, on the likes of Svek, Rotation or wherever, next thing you've got Mr.Sliff re-interperting E-Dancer, DC 20.5, "Re-manipulated" remix and the whole Beyer/Drumcode thing has become legendary.

I think also that the sharpness and loudness of Beyer's productions made them attractive for people to mix, and on a 4 track ep for instance, all of the tracks would be instantly mixable. No fade ins, few breaks, and a pretty incessant energy all the way through. When you bought a Beyer or Drumcode style record you knew what to expect, but the difference was he was actually going somewhere with it and managed to make it last for a lot of years. Now you often get a record that in theory is made in the same way, but by a producer who is not truly inspired and is merely putting out something, just to put something out. I have most of the Drumcode releases, and quite a lot of them stand out in their own way.

If I can remember back, the thing that grabbed me most about Beyer's tracks were quite literally, the impact of the kick... as well as the rhythm and swing he applied to it. It was unique.
Im starting to think your one of the people who talk sense on here mr Sunil :clap:

[The Overfiend]

Hey, I don`t like Mars Volta, or Metallica. Anyone else wanna spit a dummy?

Sacrilege

[The Overfiend]

mastered the art of compression................

compression isn't really an art and if it is (or at least if people think it is)... we're all in big trouble. i mean setting a high ratio, pushing the gain and slapping a fast attack on a bass line or lower mids isn't anything praiseworthy (i'd rate a final mixdown and equalization much higher than compression. anyways the real compressing really goes down at the cut imo). these are things one would think you should know before even setting your ideas to the canvas. post has nothing to do with pre imo. so many times i've heard people post produce their track before the the pre production has even been scrutinized.

back to the topic.. to me adam made some really good tracks (conform 12 anyone?)...and has proven diverse in influence and as far as dj'ing goes he's definitely one to check out. whether he deserves exaltation.. eh i'm not so sure. he gets respect any how.

dude, I hate to point a finger at you, but if that`s all you think compression is, then you don`t knbow much about it.


do you want me to go into what i know then? in a thread about adam beyer? please.quit hanging off my johnson bro

[fitipaldi]

I got mills tracks, and a few albums, but I didn`t pay for them, and I don`t ever listen to them.



i'll take these off your hands mate if you dislike them so much ;)

[basslinejunkie]

Ahhh but what about beyer.
Obviously opinion here thinks he made contribution to techno at all.


thats who i was talking about

[gunjack]

10 PAGES ON BEYER'S "INFLUENCE"?! DUDE ONLY CAME OUT IN WHAT, 95, 96? I DONT EVEN KNOW, BUT THE FACT IS THAT IF WE ARE BEING INFLUENCED BY SOMETHING AS GENERIC AS BEYER RECORDS, THE SCOPE OF VISION IS NOT VERY BROAD. I TRY NJOT TO LISTEN TO TECHNO AT ALL, TAKE INFLUENCES FROM ETHNIC MUSIC, JAZZ, ROCK, FUNK, BUT F U C K "EMULATING" TECHNO!!!!

[SlavikSvensk]

10 PAGES ON BEYER'S "INFLUENCE"?! DUDE ONLY CAME OUT IN WHAT, 95, 96? I DONT EVEN KNOW, BUT THE FACT IS THAT IF WE ARE BEING INFLUENCED BY SOMETHING AS GENERIC AS BEYER RECORDS, THE SCOPE OF VISION IS NOT VERY BROAD. I TRY NJOT TO LISTEN TO TECHNO AT ALL, TAKE INFLUENCES FROM ETHNIC MUSIC, JAZZ, ROCK, FUNK, BUT F U C K "EMULATING" TECHNO!!!!

man, i respect you as a producer, but i really don't think you get what is meant by influence here. who is talking about emulating adam beyer? if you read the posts, especially mine, carefully, you'll see that i (and others) clearly state that emulating adam beyer's drumcode records has often produced mediocre, throwaway drumtracks.

what my question was is why have adam beyer's records been so frequently ripped off, copied, emulated, whatever? you say "f*ck emulating techno" and take influences from other places. fine. i agree with you, though maybe in less strident terms. i'm more likely to get psyched to make tracks after listening to the bar-kays, steve reich or fela kuti than drumcode or purpose maker. but that does not negate the fact that mainstream techno changed after adam beyer (and some contemporaries).

i like a lot of his records. not necessarily the ones on drumcode though. but that's just my personal taste and not the point here. whether you like him or not is really not the point at all.

[miles]

do you take influences or just sample them? ;) ...

[miles]

gunsack that is!

[Joseph Isaac]

I`m off to kill myself.

LOL! Steve, come on now, its not that serious, bro!! :cool:

[SlavikSvensk]

hmm...my last post...one line should read "who is talking about how people should emulate adam beyer?" not "who is talking about emulating adam beyer?"

[dirty_bass]

I`m off to kill myself.

LOL! Steve, come on now, its not that serious, bro!! :cool:

HAHAHAHA
ummm
what can I say

Caffeine is bad.

[The Overfiend]

gunsack that is!
chill

[temp_er]

i find him to have been a key figure for many things firm and pumping in techno until several years ago. his production used to be bliss, live mixing hard, fluent and precise, and bottom line - it used to really be fun hearing him live.
the question now should be how well do you think he'll make it in the progressive trance scene given his recent work... :lol:

[massplanck]

Im starting to think your one of the people who talk sense on here mr Sunil :clap:


Sunil is the truth.

[gunjack]

gunsack that is!


dude, anybody else ever notice how hard this kid is riding my nuts? look at the forum for miles posts, and you will see that the only time he posts is to talk shit to gumbo. not that i mind that much, but it does seem odd that that is all this fool gots to say no? :clap:

[Heroes]

important enough to generate 155 reply posts to date on the topic

[gunjack]

damn glenn! way to bring the thread back just to say "i told you so" ;) snyway bro, i kno i am being rough on yer boy, but i am just trying to challenge these kids to be creative about what they consider "important influence"

[SlavikSvensk]

damn glenn! way to bring the thread back just to say "i told you so" ;) snyway bro, i kno i am being rough on yer boy, but i am just trying to challenge these kids to be creative about what they consider "important influence"

it's baaaaaaaaack!

you still don't get what i meant by influence... ;)

[fresh_an_funky_design]

it was a beyer mix that really changed my tastes from d'n'b to techno. tune wise he has released some absolute belters. Remainings 3 when it came out was amazing. Some of his more recent stuff im not as into but the guy is a legend and was one of the main men in techno.

[Mucky Beats]

beyer is one of the best techno producers the world will ever see ... i'm shure that makes him important to techno as a whole!

[gunjack]

beyer is one of the best techno producers the world will ever see ...

bah :roll:

[The Overfiend]

Important Influence

Kraftwerk

[SlavikSvensk]

the point of this never-dying-thread was not to provoke an adam beyer lovefest...influence can mean a lot of things. not all are good. the oil industry has a huge influence on all our lives, but how many people think that is a good thing?

saying adam beyer has been influential doesn't mean you love him and it doesn't even mean you need to like his music.

the people dissing him though offer the strongest argument that he has been influential...if he was insignificant, no one would care...

[Heroes]

damn glenn! way to bring the thread back just to say "i told you so" ;) snyway bro, i kno i am being rough on yer boy, but i am just trying to challenge these kids to be creative about what they consider "important influence"

yea i hear ya, but the argument is how important was he or is he, popularity moves people to cloning in an influencial way, thats not his fault, but most loved are always most hated because it brings out the challenge in people while they rise to such status, same with all the mills threads ive read on here. but i tell ya people who slag mills, ya wanna try to make that stuff its harder than ya think, bells is a classic example i mean that track ****in rocks out but when ya listen to the elements its nothing until you have a bash yaself and then you realise how hard it is. belive me you can be as rough as ya want on beyer "he aint my boy" but none the less i think his rise at the time was a refreshing point for the scene, and i do believe its needed again. i think we all have to dig a little deeper...

[SlavikSvensk]

yea i hear ya, but the argument is how important was he or is he, popularity moves people to cloning in an influencial way, thats not his fault, but most loved are always most hated because it brings out the challenge in people while they rise to such status, same with all the mills threads ive read on here. but i tell ya people who slag mills, ya wanna try to make that stuff its harder than ya think, bells is a classic example i mean that track **** rocks out but when ya listen to the elements its nothing until you have a bash yaself and then you realise how hard it is. belive me you can be as rough as ya want on beyer "he aint my boy" but none the less i think his rise at the time was a refreshing point for the scene, and i do believe its needed again. i think we all have to dig a little deeper...

:clap: :clap: :clap:

[BloodStar]

for my techno is very timportant.. i like all his production,ale early Drumcode stuff and more minimal stuff he§s doing today,,., his dj skills is fantastic,. question is,,where techno would be without him??

[BloodStar]

for my techno is very important.. i like all his production,.all early Drumcode stuff and more minimal stuff he§s doing today,,., as a DJ he is fantastic, i§ve heard him several time and i was impressed,.,always,.. question is,,where techno would be without Adam Beyer??

[BloodStar]

shit :oops:

[massplanck]

shit :oops:


http://forums.ratedesi.com/images/smilies/stickpokesmiley.gif

[gunjack]

good points glenn, i am the king of the generalization round these parts and i freely admit it, but c'mon guys the "swedish revolution"?! i will never forgot the first time i read that on here lol. i got a little girl i know in sweden and she has been laughing her head off about this. MUSPRUTT to the over compressed bongo loops ;)


anyway like those acid techno heads are always saying: "i'll get my coat".