Sven Wittekind

[Spark]

What do you think of his productions?! And how is he as a dj!?

I need to know. .

[TripleX]

he is a very talented producer, i think him and amok are gonna be big in techno :twisted: .
I have some of his sets, they are pretty good too...

[Pathogen]

yep i agree with that triple x, they are for sure names that are moving forward through their quailty productions.
svens releases on shubfactor are nice (allthougth the last wasnt my cup of tea), and records with apperances by him are allways gunna be worth a listen.

[MARKEG]

yes we love sven here :)

[technosnob]

I've only heard one of his sets....

Based on that, what he plays and what he makes are two different things.
His own stuff is alot harder than the stuff he dropped on this particular set.

[Spark]

I like his productions very much!

In the future we from Future Sounds want to book him for one of our party's..

[JACKSTAR]

His best release is by far his one on Kne'Deep 25.... not sure of the title as mine's a promo but every single track is a killer.

[DJAmok]

got Thrill 007 promo yet? B1 is a real killer! :shock: Thought Evil sent you one?

[death on a stick]

I downloaded and listened to some Wittekind and Amok tunes last night, seeing as they get spoken of a lot round here. Have to say it ranks high up amongst the most pointless, generic nonsense I've ever heard.

[JACKSTAR]

Are you sure you didn't download some wonky techno ? Eitherway I don't think you should diss the production of someone who uses this forum on a regular basis even if you don't like it.

Do I feel another OVERLOAD coming on ???

(Mark be aware)

P.

[MARKEG]

yeah death - this needs to stop. thanks J.

i think 90% of the ppl who use this club/hard techno forum think completely the opposite to what you said there. i love sven's music - in fact I asked him to release on blackout. and i asked dj amok to send me his work and although it wasn't quite right, i definitely thought it was totally not pointless, generic nonsense. .

why are you even on this forum if you don't like club/hard techno???????

[death on a stick]

I don't feel I dissed it, merely gave an honest appraisal of it.

I've had my music criticised and praised on Blackout. I've praised and criticised other people's music on Blackout, as has every other member. Are your mates exempt from criticism on Blackout?

I don't see why anyone should be exempt from having their productions assessed by anyone else, whether they happen to read it or not. If you put your stuff in the public arena you can expect public reactions.




that sort of statement belongs in the dark/experimental forum
Why?




why are you even on this forum if you don't like club/hard techno???????
I do like hard techno, and I do like club techno.


And what's with the comparisons with Overload? You can go on there any day and read heaps of praise about a huge variety of artists from just about every style of music, from pop down to pure noise. Of course, there is criticism too...as there is here. Are we really that narrow minded on Blackout that we can't handle the idea that everything we do may not be as wonderful as we think? Are we unable to question the validity of our work in the light of other people's observations (no matter how crude it may have been - believe me, I was as nice I could have been).

[MARKEG]

not as wonderful as we think?

ok sven and amok are rather new hard techno producers and still have a long way to go compared to the likes of wilson and patrick s but pointless, generic crap - no way.

how come i remember thowing down sven's last track on overdrive at a huge hard techno party abroad 6 months ago and 6,000 ppl went nuts.

you telling me they're all into pointless generic crap?

more to the point you're telling me i'm into pointless generic crap!

no man, don't agree with you. you have your opinion, i have mine.

but next time instead of putting pointless generic crap and then being forced into giving your reasons - please be less flipant and explain yourself.

[MARKEG]

also think about it m8. you come onto a forum which talks about nothing but club and hard techno saying what these two make (ie hard techno) is pointless generic crap. you simply have to expect people to disagree with you.

[Patrick]

Do I feel another OVERLOAD coming on ???

(Mark be aware)

P.

Paul, can you explain this reference please ? I've seen you, and others, make this type of remark a few times and I don't understand it.
I also use OL as well as Blackout and a few other forums and I don't think OL is as bad as people make out. It seems to have picked up a reputation that seems a bit undeserved to me. And it's a bit unfair on Woody (who also uses Blackout regularly so I'm sure he can pitch his own tuppence worth in) and Ali for people to be making remarks about OL purely based on the behaviour of a minortity in the past on their forum. Remember OL, like Blackout, is a lot more than just a forum. There's a wealth of useful info and some fantastic articles on there. They deserve a lot more credit for what they've done.

Anyway, not having a go or anything. I'm a fairly new user on OL and like I said it seems a fairly sound forum to me with lots of sound people using it, so I'm kind of intrigued as to what the history is behind those comments. Have you had a bad experience on there ? I can only remember seeing positive stuff about you, especially in the events section, but like I said I'm fairly new to it.

[death on a stick]

point·less (pointls) adj.

Lacking meaning; senseless.
Ineffectual: pointless attempts to rescue the victims of the raging fire
Syn: Blunt; obtuse, dull; stupid



ge·ner·ic (j-nrk) adj.

Relating to or descriptive of an entire group or class;
Biology. Of or relating to a genus.



non·sense (nnsns, -sns) n.

Subject matter, behavior, or language that is foolish or absurd.
Extravagant foolishness or frivolity: a clown's exuberant nonsense.
Matter of little or no importance or usefulness
Insolent talk or behavior; impudence: wouldn't take any nonsense from the children.




OK - more detailed appraisal.

I'm afraid I can't provide the exact track names as I deleted them immediately after listening to them, but two of them were the same track, a SW original and an Amok remix. These two tracks, along with the others I heard, all consisted of cheaply constructed sounds put together in an entirely unimaginative way that replicated many hundreds or even thousands of almost identical and equally poorly thought out tracks that have been released over the last 10 years or so. The structure was entirely generic - the usual combination of boom boom kick drums, add a hissy ride, have a little breakdown, do a bit of filtering, repeat ad infinitum. To be honest myself and the other person in the room were laughing while listening to it. I was tempted to ask on here if the whole thing SW/Amok/Skull tunes saga was a joke that I hadn't cottoned onto yet.

You say they are new to producing techno - it shows.


a general, but related note - There'd be a whole lot less garbage to sift through if people took the time to listen to their music and ask themselves "should I release this? does this add anything to the techno world other than 1000 pieces of circular plastic? what does this music offer that makes it stand out from the thousands of other records out there?".

More self assessment and a whole lot more experience would go a long way.


Of course, people could just pump out their tracks willy nilly on as many labels as are willing to have them, without bothering to question whether the music is good enough or if it's worth releasing dozens of indistinguishable tracks. That's their choice, as everyone has a choice as to their opinions of it.

Perhaps my initial post was too unsophisticated - but it was a reflection of the subject matter.

[death on a stick]

also think about it m8. you come onto a forum which talks about nothing but club and hard techno saying what these two make (ie hard techno) is pointless generic crap. you simply have to expect people to disagree with you.
I have no problem with people disagreeing with me, and of course I was not surprised that it happened.

As I said in an earlier post, I like hard techno, and I like club techno. Not that I really see the distinction.

[TripleX]

this discussion is pointless :roll: , we have this on german forums all the time, it´s a never ending story........
everybody´s taste in music differs....., so it´s pretty hard to talk objective about music , (it´s not possible if you ask me).
it´s defenetly okay to not like amok & wittekind stuff, but it´s not okay to say their music is crap, pointless etc, that´s a arrogant way and of course offends people who like that kinda music....
I dun like trance for example, but i don´t say trance is sh!t....(because i don´t understand it)

[MARKEG]

exactly. death on a stick it's not the fact you disagreed with me or dislike sven/amok's music (although i do disagree with you cause i love hard techno and have a problem with that in principle). it's the way you said it. you've been warned about your type of flipant remarks by our main admin Gandalf before. we have to stamp these type of comments out. you're actually lucky he's gone on holiday for a week or i know he would have banned you. if you want to keep on using this board, please don't use cocky, flipant remarks such as pointless generic nonsense. they serve no purpose at all. and i don't need the definitions pointed out to me like you're some kind of english school teacher.

anyway, i say this:

read the rules.

and you will realise there is definitely no point in discussing this matter further.

i hope you sort it out mate :D

post locked.

[MARKEG]

ok post unlocked.

adverse you had something to say??????

[MARKEG]

btw adverse, if gandalf would have banned him it would be because he BROKE THE RULES. not because of ANYTHING else he said in the posts. to recap:

'THE GOLDEN RULE: This board must stay as informative and constructive as possible. Respect and friendliness towards other board members is a must. Anyone who puts this in jepardy will be banned. Rest assured, there will be no exceptions.

To help you on your path, when you post:

Don't be disrespectful to other DJ's/Promoters/Music Styles without a genuine reason.

Try your best to be positive at all times. Blatant negativity is going to get us nowhere.

Use this resourse for what it is - a resourse. Constructive arguements are welcome here. This is not a place to argue until you're blue in the face. If someone is being disrespectful, forget about it - they will eventually be banned if they keep it up.

Have fun. Discuss things. Disagree amicably - but understand the line! Music people are the true force that feeds this site. If you're not here for music, then leave immediately.

Welcome the Underground Network.'

Calling something pointless generic crap is both disrespectful and unconstuctive. Besides, he's broken the rules before and i'm letting him break them again!!!!!! What does this say to our board members??!?!!!

This really is the last time I'm letting him do this.

[Adverse]

ok i must apologize to mark. i misunderstood the nature of of the thread and subsequent warning to fellow board member death on a stick. i was in discord over substance when mark was upset over derogation. sorry board. sorry mark.

[Esox Lucius]

I agree with d.o.a.s that there is too much crap being released, as for the whole SW/Amok thing, personally I like most of their tunes and I think they are pretty good producers.

I don`t think death has crossed a mark as such as he has backed his comments up, which is a lot more than most people do on other forums, he could have just said it was crap and gave no reason.

that`s my 2 cents anyway :D

[MARKEG]

i too, totally agree with death on a stick that there is too much crap being released and want to take this discusion further. i have 'disagreement' with him that sven wittekind's music is not good but like Triple said, it's a pointless discussion.

but the major issue i have with him is that he wrote his original comments flipantly and disrespectfully.

i love death's upfrontness and openess and he is a valued and loved member of the board. yet, if he breaks rules, he is not wanted here - just like anyone else who does this.

and even if he did this, i'd still respect him outside of the internet environment and always listen to what he had to say. for those that know me, i don't hold grudges, there's too much hate out there.

but if there's one thing i will not have in my life, it's disrespect. if that usually happens to me, i'll up and leave or walk away and keep my distance. unfortuntely the only way i can do that on this board environment is by banning someone. therefore i've made rules and i propose to stick to them.

i really hope you realise this guys. there's nothing wrong with arguments and disagrements. it's comments like generic pointless crap, with no substance in the same sentence to back them up, that annoys me here.

[davethedrummer]

I downloaded and listened to some Wittekind and Amok tunes last night, seeing as they get spoken of a lot round here. Have to say it ranks high up amongst the most pointless, generic nonsense I've ever heard.

i don't get it
i don't think he really said anything that bad.
he just said he didn't like it!
what's wrong with that?
there's plenty of other club/hard techno producers i could slag off
and plenty others who would slag me off
but at the end of the day
mr death wasn't really slagging anyone
was he????

on a more positive note
i haven't heard dj amok
but i've been sent a lot of e-mail blah from him
so i'm gonna check him out and see what it's all about
i've been in touch with his website designer

nice site.....

hmmmm

[MARKEG]

it's not that death on a stick said he didn't like it.

it's that he said 'pointless generic nonsense' - in one flipant sentense without reason.

that's what i don't like and i don't want this type of comment on here.

[davethedrummer]

actually
the reason i am convinced of deaths innosence is the use of the word generic.
thing is, that in this statement he gives away the fact that he doesn't know what alll the fuss is about, because to him this music is just following suit with other well trodden paths of techno. and this means it is pointless.

o.k. "crap" perhaps is a bit strong but "generic" and "pointless" are words of critique and i think they are justified.
i know this is a forum and i know that it's vibe is to be positive ,
so come on be positive !

[MARKEG]

i totaly agree with you...

doas has an arguement which we need to discuss further.....

sure he's annoyed but - pointless generic rubbish???? i really dont think so to be honest. i am a board member and i love this guy's music.

what anyones me about this sentence is like he knows best. how come he knows best? it annoys me that he should think this.... in one sentence.

'pointless generic nonsense'

it's a ridiculous arguement. it's all opinion!

therefore he's offended me.

i made a rule. ie please dont say anyyone's music is 'shite' without reason. don't offend other board memebers. i made this for a reason. it matter's to me - dont ask me why - it just does! if you're going to slag something of, justify it. it's a rule of this board. you all read the rules when you joined. i love you all dearly, but please god realise that this is what holds this board together :)

[dcdn]

hi all, you know where this is all about??

When there is a hype going on or just like in this topic a big upcoming producer collective from Germany, which produces good things there are ALWAYS guys that want to provoke against it just to get a reaction or just for the fun, i mean this is a hard/club techno forum so they listen to hard/club techno i would recon. But its just that some people although they like it (often) want to be against the mass who really say they like it. Therefore this ongoing discussion here is pointless and no need for, just let them say they thik its nothing at all and leave it is my opinion....

[DJAmok]

holy mother of **** , ya don´t watch a forum carefully every day and things start gettin out of hand :shock:


ya know, I figured out what track death on must´ve downloaded, and to be honest, that wasn´t really our best effort at producing. The Track he downlaoded and my remix are now around 18 months old, and back then I didn´t even have a vinyl out, I was still learning (still am, too).

Then again, I´m pretty sure he won´t like our new stuff either, if he missed the point once, he´ll miss it again. But since I can´t speak for Sven, but I´ll speak for myself from now on.

You can check out a remix I did for Arkus P. if you want (Compressor wasn´t set up right when I recorded it so please ignore the fact, that the Breaks get so loud, this is not the final version!)

http://www.djamok.net/dd/Arkus%20P.%20-%20Artillery%20002%20-%20B1%20-%20Amokfahrt%20nach%20Polen%20(DJ%20Amok%20Remix%2 0Testversion).mp3

And here´s my Artillery 001

http://www.djamok.net/dd/DJ%20Amok%20-%20Artillery001%20A1.mp3


Now where were we? Critisism is cool and always welcome, I´m still new at this (tad bit more than 2 years) and even though right now I´m really hitting the taste of a young hardtechno generation out there, I still want to learn more and get better and I believe there will always be room for improvement. Having said that, critisism could often be a lot more constructive and helpful and less insulting and generic....

We´ve got a big discussion going on on German forums at the time, and appearantly it pisses a lot of people off royaly, that new German hardtechno is doing so well at the moment. The arguments I hear most, is that it´s pointless and that the bpm are too high. I don´t know about Sven Wittekind or Chris Noise, Obi or any of the others, but I try to make my crowd happy with my tunes. I´ve been Djing now for about 18 months
and I´ve been carefully watching the crowd´s reaction, did a little research on what rhythms get em going and what bores them. Then I blend this with my personal taste of how I want my techno to be, try to check if it works well at 160bpm (some of us have a habit of spinning at this speed) and out comes what you´ll probably be listenin to right now: hard aggressive techno. Not everyone likes it, and I don´t expect everyone to do so, there´s enough techno out there for everyone.


@ Dave:
what do you mean with you´ve been receiving email blah from me? I hope no one out there is sending out any spam in my name :(

btw props for "Buried Alive" one of my all time favs ;)

[DJ Corbzy]

god! you techno lot are well feisty! :lol:

[DJAmok]

I´ll say :shock: :lol: :oops:

[DJ Corbzy]

I wish the trance forums was a little more like that, it's always nice to be involved in a few heated discussions....

Arguing shows two things, Ignorance or Passion :wink:

[Sven Wittekind]

hey a topic about me :shock:
NOW i am IMPORTANT :lol:

no ok ... thx to all People who like my stuff.
@ MarkEG : Let us talk again soon (blackout release)

regards
sven wittekind

[DJPAUZE]

Just got Bitshift 01 HOLY MOTHER OF GOD!!!!
Its the best i have heard from wittekind so far

Pauze :twisted:

[Bughead]

Well either way, DJ Amok and Sven Wittekind, keep up the good work.

Harder and Faster....

[Angrymann]

Just read through all the comments and have to say out of all this , I give massive credit to Dj Amok , who didn't take or appear to take any offence to the comments at all. That's the only way to do it , cause if you all wanted to produce records that were going to be accepted by most people then Techno would not be the genre. Techno enthusiasts are the most crticial ( I may be wrong here cause I only love techno don't pay attention to much else as passionately) , on every forum you get as much praise for a guy as you do slander. I personally prefer to see a bit of constructive criticism and I do believe folk should speak their mind. There is nothing worse to me than folk always sucking up to folk just cause they are a big name , surely none of you want that. Some people criticise nothing so they can conform or be accepted easier , there is no point in that whatsoever , just as there is no point in saying " ach that's pish".

I think the reason that there is a clash is that Death on a stick appears to me to have old school beliefs and possibly isn't prepared to accept certain pieces of music because they don't seem to him to have any real musical substance or add anything NEW to the genre( in his opinion). I would hazard a guess and say that he possibly leans towards Detroit style techno ,something that he feels has more real substance to it ( this is a complete guess). I do like the way he expresses his opinion and would say that you can't really say he is being flippant because you can only take it the way you read it , if you already think he is like that then you will automatically read his posts that way. That said , I am still to see him say anything good about any records or anything on the site , who knows , maybe one day.

Anyway , I am off to downlaod Amok's tracks and give them a listen. take it easy boys

[Col]

fuk me the forum is on fire today!!!! :twisted:

[Bughead]

Isnt it better anyway having people discussing their creations and having out in public forums ;) than having it sit somewhere doing nothing...