the future of techno

[Adverse]

is not in the music but in it's politics. case in point is the childishly frivolous attitudes this board houses. a scene that allows people to act as if they've created a classical symphony after a few sophmoric and sketchy releases is one doomed to stagnate in mediocrity and lawless degeneration. techno needs an umbrella organization that is subjected to standards of release with real houses for criticism and friendship alike. the failure of any humility on the part of many producers on this board is typical of the kind of people who allow it to go on. and it's nepotistic/clic tendancies are servile to nothing but negativity within the community.

i have much more to say but that's the gist of it. one man's tryingly objective opinion.. i have no stakes nor am i here for popularity. i just observe.

the time to put an end to this... really.

sincerely mark.

i know there are some intelligent people here i've spoken to you... you know you can do better than this...

[gunjack]

well said mark!

[Sunil]

To be honest I've near enough had enough of this place. I've tried, and probably wasted too much time here as a result. There's a good community here and some people with interesting opinions and useful knowledge. I dunno though, although I check these forums regularly I'm starting to see it as pretty pointless to be involved anymore.

[stjohn]

To be honest I've near enough had enough of this place. I've tried, and probably wasted too much time here as a result. There's a good community here and some people with interesting opinions and useful knowledge. I dunno though, although I check these forums regularly I'm starting to see it as pretty pointless to be involved anymore.

i might have thought the opposite!

i know theres always a load of stupid discussions + arguments, but i usually ignore them, and dont bother posting. i find it exhilerating to see so many heads passionate about the exact same thing that im passionate about, even though im a little irish no-one! ;) it kinda makes me want to get my shit together and then share it back out

[dirty_bass]

I think people are staring to make interesting comments.
And thankfully, the humour seems to be coming back.

I do agree with Mark and his post.

There really does need to be some more fraternity within the community, rather than people clawing over each other to get to the top of a shrinking scene.
MeMeMe needs to turn into We We We

It`s odd though.

When you do open your arms and offer to help people, you get shot at, or just nothing at all.

Apathy?

hehe, the setting up of a techno council seems to be the upshot of marks post, not sure I`m with that exactly, but maybe there should be a more concious effort to pull together rather than stand in clique.

[dirty_bass]

And yeah, humour, humility and fun needs to come back.
Things get way to serious sometimes.

[stjohn]

hehe, the setting up of a techno council seems to be the upshot of marks post, not sure I`m with that exactly, but maybe there should be a more concious effort to pull together rather than stand in clique.

maybe if it was like the pure blood Vampire council in BLADE! then it would be cool! :evil:

[gunjack]

To be honest I've near enough had enough of this place. I've tried, and probably wasted too much time here as a result. There's a good community here and some people with interesting opinions and useful knowledge. I dunno though, although I check these forums regularly I'm starting to see it as pretty pointless to be involved anymore.


ditto

[gunjack]

There really does need to be some more fraternity within the community, rather than people clawing over each other to get to the top of a shrinking scene.

ummmmm last time i checked, YOU JUMPED SHIP on our community. remember?


The problem is, I want to go waaaay beyond techno


this is the problem right here. see, i like to make other kinds of music too but i wouldn't put them "beyond" another style because each style has it's value. you are always talking about "beyond" this and "above" that, while the rest of us are trying to keep our favorite music alive.

[Adverse]

hehe, the setting up of a techno council seems to be the upshot of marks post, not sure I`m with that exactly, but maybe there should be a more concious effort to pull together rather than stand in clique.

maybe if it was like the pure blood Vampire council in BLADE! then it would be cool! :evil:

this isn't meant to be cool. serious if you are happy with seemingly almost complete decimation of techno in the last 4 years you should be taking my post rather seriously.

[dirty_bass]

There really does need to be some more fraternity within the community, rather than people clawing over each other to get to the top of a shrinking scene.

ummmmm last time i checked, YOU JUMPED SHIP on our community. remember?


The problem is, I want to go waaaay beyond techno


this is the problem right here. see, i like to make other kinds of music too but i wouldn't put them "beyond" another style because each style has it's value. you are always talking about "beyond" this and "above" that, while the rest of us are trying to keep our favorite music alive.

If by jumping ship you mean, turning my label over to new techno producers I respect then yes, I jumped.

Techno is great, but musically limited in terms of pure art, so yes, I want to go beyond it, for my own personal journey.
Doesn`t mean I won`t still make it or listen to it.

However, I think by making the above comments you are, in fact, doing the opposite of marks comments that you agreed with/

If you want to carry this on, really, get mark to open the vex forum, I think it`s a little childish dragging it all around the board.

Although for me, the subject is hisotry allready.

[dirty_bass]

Now, as for the subject in question.
really what can we do?

Ego and greed cause a lot of the problems and to eliminate it is very hard.
More genuine acts of fraternity?

It is happening, with Glens public demo rollcall for templ8
I myself am turning future DB Releases to be mainly new talent.
I`ve seen a few other offers and similar things happening.
The club side of things is a little different, as there is a very competative streak that causes some nsty behaviour sometimes between promiters.

I dunno, it`s a real mindbender and something I¬m gonna have a good think about.

Definitely a good post though Mark.

[Adverse]

it should be remembered that this isn't a time for personal gripes it's a time for suggestive unity and collaboration in comunication. or calling out people you think are responsible for said behaviour.... i could of done that and people who know me know i would of started at the top.

but that isn't damage control. that's just fanning the flames of discontent.

[Vin-iLL]

Mark, thank you for this mirror!

[stjohn]

hehe, the setting up of a techno council seems to be the upshot of marks post, not sure I`m with that exactly, but maybe there should be a more concious effort to pull together rather than stand in clique.

maybe if it was like the pure blood Vampire council in BLADE! then it would be cool! :evil:

this isn't meant to be cool. serious if you are happy with seemingly almost complete decimation of techno in the last 4 years you should be taking my post rather seriously.

i did take it seriously, and i understand your frustration with it all, maybe if i had been around as long as the heads i might be the same, but ALAS, i havnt, so forgiveness please!

so where can you take it from here, some kind a quality control label/stamp?

"this tune has been approved by 'QUIET' quality underground industrial electronic TECHNO" with a big Q stamp on it." (no snottiness in that remark, just a passing idea.)

seriously though could industry standards be introduced similar to contruction&trade?

[gunjack]

this isn't about a personal gripe.

a guy like dirty is the perfect exaple of the folks that ruin what we build.

they segregate themselves and look down on folks because they think techno is "stagnant", well hey! why not make a tune that sounds fresh then and stop complaining?


dirty bass, folks like you are ther reason there is internal beef in techno, you just can't help but get on your high horse even though you freely admit that the "history" of this music doesn't interest you.


how did this music get started? it was the idea of using emerging technologies to make new music and make ppl move. TECHNO IS NOT SOME ARTSY FARTSY outlet for you to show your intellectual superiority, IT IS ENTERTAINMET AND EXPRESSION.

folks seem to forget that this is PARTY MUSIC and while we can make deep and intenese compositions within the structure of that, at the end of the day, you won't hear techno in carnegie hall or a f ucking musem.


THE FUTURE OF TECHNO?



how about getting off out high horses and rocking the crowd? how about working within the skeletal foundations to initiate change?



HOW ABOUT PUTTING OUT RECORDS INSTEAD OF BITCHING ON THE INTERNET ABOUT WHAT IS WRONG WITH TECHNO?

[dirty_bass]

who`s bitching?

[gunjack]

do you ppl know why the market collapsed in spain?
i will tell you because i saw it first hand:


too many producers thinking they were dark and cutting edge, putting out records that sounded the same and FORGETTING ABOUT THE AUDIENCE. now they have 30,000 producers with a cool rep and no gigs to play at. an audience who feels alienated by "dark music" that goes on from start to finish at events and ELITISM


yes i said it:


ELITISM - producers thinking they are too cool to work with folks in other styles etc. etc. etc.


when i agreed to do an MB selektions single, folks on the board laughed at me for crossing camps! mulero said he would not do a remix for the single because it "was not his style" now what? that "style" has a warehouse full of records that only sold 200 copies and what? james ruskin and claude young did an MB single?!?!?!? clutch the pearls! maybe we were wrong?!
you know how much shit i got for appearing on C. varella's black codes label?!?! but then when the record came out with regis on it lots of you charted it... hmmmmm


maybe we were cutting off our ears to spite our noses huh? maybe we shouldn't have been talking all that shit about other artists who weren't viewed as "dark" or "pounding".... but alas! it is too late! we have drwan lines between ourselves and the folks we should have been working with in order to diversify, and now we have painted ourselves into a corner! and what do we do? we sit in that corner and complain about it while alienating the folks who buy our records!


i am sick of all this drama, but when are you ppl going to understand that it ain't gotta be this way? stop drawing imaginary lines that you are scared to death to cross!


i may not play varella records very often, but talking to him about the future gives me more hope than talking to 90% of you lot.


if you guys still can't see the forest for the tress then, by all means, keep looking.

[AcidTrash]

this isn't about a personal gripe.

a guy like dirty is the perfect exaple of the folks that ruin what we build.

they segregate themselves and look down on folks because they think techno is "stagnant", well hey! why not make a tune that sounds fresh then and stop complaining?


dirty bass, folks like you are ther reason there is internal beef in techno, you just can't help but get on your high horse even though you freely admit that the "history" of this music doesn't interest you.


how did this music get started? it was the idea of using emerging technologies to make new music and make ppl move. TECHNO IS NOT SOME ARTSY FARTSY outlet for you to show your intellectual superiority, IT IS ENTERTAINMET AND EXPRESSION.

folks seem to forget that this is PARTY MUSIC and while we can make deep and intenese compositions within the structure of that, at the end of the day, you won't hear techno in carnegie hall or a f ucking musem.


THE FUTURE OF TECHNO?



how about getting off out high horses and rocking the crowd? how about working within the skeletal foundations to initiate change?



HOW ABOUT PUTTING OUT RECORDS INSTEAD OF BITCHING ON THE INTERNET ABOUT WHAT IS WRONG WITH TECHNO?

:clap: :clap: :lol:

[gunjack]

the last time we had this discussion, i recieved a p.m. from someone who really summed it up. this person prefers to remain anonymous, but i am gonna quote the p.m. i recieved during the last bout of "future of techno" anyway. here it is:



There are way too many preening egotists overintellectualising techno and forgetting about the spirit of techno. Some people on here have completely forgotton what techno is about and some poeople, mentioning no names, should get the f*ck off BOA because the way they want to stear their music simply isn't techno.

I feel that if people are looking for an intellectual challenge they should really be doing something else other than techno. IT's fun music for fun people and the way these guys talk about it makes us look like deranged bitter snobs with no real zest for life or techno. I bet some of these people don't even dance at clubs if they even go to them at all. We need motivated DJ's and producers, and not bitter critics.

Talent is secondary to enthusiasm in my book. I'd rather pick up people with a can do attitude and half the skill than experts who make a beautiful thing a tiresome routine.

I've been considering saying the same but its all a bit touchy at the moment and I've spoken my mind once too often to be bothered doing it again so I salute your for having the courage to stand up and say these things. Someone needed to.




indeed!

[G-BO]

do you ppl know why the market collapsed in spain?
i will tell you because i saw it first hand:


too many producers thinking they were dark and cutting edge, putting out records that sounded the same and FORGETTING ABOUT THE AUDIENCE. now they have 30,000 producers with a cool rep and no gigs to play at. an audience who feels alienated by "dark music" that goes on from start to finish at events and ELITISM


yes i said it:


ELITISM - producers thinking they are too cool to work with folks in other styles etc. etc. etc.


when i agreed to do an MB selektions single, folks on the board laughed at me for crossing camps! mulero said he would not do a remix for the single because it "was not his style" now what? that "style" has a warehouse full of records that only sold 200 copies and what? james ruskin and claude young did an MB single?!?!?!? clutch the pearls! maybe we were wrong?!
you know how much shit i got for appearing on C. varella's black codes label?!?! but then when the record came out with regis on it lots of you charted it... hmmmmm


maybe we were cutting off our ears to spite our noses huh? maybe we shouldn't have been talking all that shit about other artists who weren't viewed as "dark" or "pounding".... but alas! it is too late! we have drwan lines between ourselves and the folks we should have been working with in order to diversify, and now we have painted ourselves into a corner! and what do we do? we sit in that corner and complain about it while alienating the folks who buy our records!


i am sick of all this drama, but when are you ppl going to understand that it ain't gotta be this way? stop drawing imaginary lines that you are scared to death to cross!


i may not play varella records very often, but talking to him about the future gives me more hope than talking to 90% of you lot.


if you guys still can't see the forest for the tress then, by all means, keep looking.

havent been on this forum long enough or often enough to understand some of the bitterness or direct provocation that seems to be directed to others or created by others....but im with this guy!!! :clap:

[dirty_bass]

Techno can be more than one thing, that is the point.
To call it purely dancefloor, for fun, or purely intellectual is against what it is.
It can be more than one thing.
But to only focus on one without the other may lead to inbreeding.
Diversity is the key to any expressive outlet.
It is fun, and it is serious, and it is angry and it is beautiful, and you can dance to it, and you can listen to it at home.
As long as there is some development.

[Martin Dust]

You guys are crazy :)

99.9 of the crowd aren't on BOA, wonder what they're doing - I bet they aint moaning or looking for the "key" to techno.

Judge me by my releases and what comes out of the speakers, I'm there for myself and the crowd, simple as.

[Jay Pace]

TECHNO IS NOT SOME ARTSY FARTSY outlet for you to show your intellectual superiority, IT IS ENTERTAINMET AND EXPRESSION.

Your opinion dude. And your shouting it from on top of your own high horse.

How come you get to define exactly what techno is and isn't?

Wouldn't it be simpler to accept that techno means different things to different people?

Then we could stop this drama queen routine of complaining and preaching about other people complaining and preaching.

People are always going to have differing opinions. Deal with it.

I think techno should be about connecting with crowds through rhythmn and energy, but this doesn't mean I have to dismiss everything else out of hand.

Room enough in this scene for all of us.

[G-BO]

its taken toll in so many forms, its hard to put a finger on what is the right direction and what is most interesting...as said ppl just need to do their own thing and label it how they please, without trying to force their views on others

[Martin Dust]

It happens on all forums, but where does it say that we all have to get on or indeed act like dicks? The thing to do is take a long hard look at your input and decide what you want to do. It's no good saying this place sucks without trying to change with some posts or ideas...

[G-BO]

its alwasy good to hear what other ppl think, even if they arent doing the same thing as ya

[Dustin Zahn]

HAhaha, this discussion again. It's about that time for the monthly techno pep talk I guess. I'm with Adverse, Gunny, and Martin Dust for the most part.

While everybody on here pisses and moans and talks about doing something, the rest of the world will move on and offer other alternatives. Maybe not tomorrow or next week, but eventually. That's nature. Spend less time on the web chatting about things you'll never do, quick strokin' each other (95% of the tracks on BOA will not sell guaranteed), and spend more time in the studio. The market hasn't disappeared, it's simply moved on without you or left you in the dust. There is tons of amazing music coming out on the regular, and believe it or not there are still people buying records (mostly minimal at the moment unfortunately). They just want something different. I need to hear another poor Glenn Wilson or Joris Voorn knock-off like I need another hole in my head.

You guys take this techno discussion too seriously. The outside world doesn't pay attention to these forums because they're too busy partying and enjoying whats already out there. To be honest, the less I read forums like these the more fun I have and interest I develop in techno. I just check these kind of sites out of bordem and curiosity to be connected to the outside world and it's usually nothing but a buzzkill.

[dan the acid man]

Surely bitching about some forms of techno being too dark and serious to be classed as techno is going against whats needed here.
this scene, for want of a better word, needs to stand together.
Im sure im not alone in listening to all styles of techno, yes I love tracks made for the floor, tracks that maybe don’t take themselves as seriously as others, but I also love listening to darker, more emotional music.
So people wouldn’t class a lot of plastikmans music as techno then, as a lot of the tracks off those albums wasn’t made for the floor.

Anyway, this discussion isn’t about this is it

[Martin Dust]

That's true Dustin, but forums have the power to do some good and god knows I get slaughtered enough on my own but I can see the good they do, what most people don't see is that 99.9% of the crowd aren't on the forum and they don't give a shit, life is to dang short.

[Martin Dust]

Surely bitching about some forms of techno being too dark and serious to be classed as techno is going against whats needed here.
this scene, for want of a better word, needs to stand together.
Im sure im not alone in listening to all styles of techno, yes I love tracks made for the floor, tracks that maybe don’t take themselves as seriously as others, but I also love listening to darker, more emotional music.
So people wouldn’t class a lot of plastikmans music as techno then, as a lot of the tracks off those albums wasn’t made for the floor.

Anyway, this discussion isn’t about this is it


Actually, the more I think about it - we could do with some techno drive-bys - never did no harm to hip-hop :twisted:

[AcidTrash]

Surely bitching about some forms of techno being too dark and serious to be classed as techno is going against whats needed here.
this scene, for want of a better word, needs to stand together.
Im sure im not alone in listening to all styles of techno, yes I love tracks made for the floor, tracks that maybe don’t take themselves as seriously as others, but I also love listening to darker, more emotional music.
So people wouldn’t class a lot of plastikmans music as techno then, as a lot of the tracks off those albums wasn’t made for the floor.

Anyway, this discussion isn’t about this is it

Yeah but if the Mark EG forum isn't a place where we can celebrate tunes made for the floor without being made to feel intelectually or artistically inferior by smug humourless knowitall twunts where the f*ck can we?

[dan the acid man]

haha yeah, that would get all the kids into techno again :cool:

[Aratron]

Surely bitching about some forms of techno being too dark and serious to be classed as techno is going against whats needed here.
this scene, for want of a better word, needs to stand together.
Im sure im not alone in listening to all styles of techno, yes I love tracks made for the floor, tracks that maybe don’t take themselves as seriously as others, but I also love listening to darker, more emotional music.
So people wouldn’t class a lot of plastikmans music as techno then, as a lot of the tracks off those albums wasn’t made for the floor.

Anyway, this discussion isn’t about this is it

Yeah but if the Mark EG forum isn't a place where we can celebrate tunes made for the floor without being made to feel intelectually or artistically inferior by smug humourless knowitall twunts where the f*ck can we?

think -tive = think ban wtf is that all about

[Akkachar]

i find techno pretty gayish...

this won't lead to anything, so cut the crap...

[Adverse]

i don't know what half of you are on about but the plot has been lost. this isn't about the outside crowd or finding the key to techno. this is about the inside track the producers and label owners/ distirbutors. the people who make techno techno and this board is a bloody microcosm of that.the shitty market in techno for the buyers and sellers is a result of lack of coordinated effort in organization and pompous nepotism. it's bloody anarchy out there and the two faces are running amok. it's a facelss business with no accountability. ask any fledgling label owner if he's ever met anyone remotely connected with selling his record. i'm talking about real accountability for everyone involved. not i made a track last week and it's being put out this week.

these atttudes not only on this board but pan techno are a result of this.

[dan the acid man]

Yeah but if the Mark EG forum isn't a place where we can celebrate tunes made for the floor without being made to feel intelectually or artistically inferior by smug humourless knowitall twunts where the f*ck can we?

i only saw this a few times when the acid techno section was with the techno section, but i cant say ive seen it since

[Adverse]

i don't know what half of you are on about but the plot has been lost. this isn't about the outside crowd or finding the key to techno. this is about the inside track the producers and label owners/ distirbutors. the people who make techno techno and this board is a bloody microcosm of that.the shitty market in techno for the buyers and sellers is a result of lack of coordinated effort in organization and pompous nepotism. it's bloody anarchy out there and the two faces are running amok. it's a facelss business with no accountability. ask any fledgling label owner if he's ever met anyone remotely connected with selling his record. i'm talking about real accountability for everyone involved. not i made a track last week and it's being put out this week.

these atttudes not only on this board but pan techno are a result of this.

[Martin Dust]

What would you like to happen Adverse, even if it's only this board?

[dirty_bass]

accountability
Hell yeah
the whole business side of things does need an overhaul.
It`s almost set up to **** you up in a way.
Better legal advice is also probably a real good idea.
In fact, there`s something I can do in this area.
My best mate is a professor in law, and is righting various papers on copyright and so on, and has told me that he will give free legal advice to poeple I put him onto from the independant music biz.

I`m gonna see if I can get him to sign up to the board and maybe get some posts online that can educate people a little.

[AcidTrash]

It does look like this thread has been hijacked for people to get stuff off their chest which is fine. I think people are reading the title as "The fututre of BOA forum" somehow.

The way for techno to really improve is to stop relying on the web to get the word out about stuff. People seem to think that the web will do all the work for them when promoting and that just posting the odd flyer on a forum is how it's done. This is a lesson that needs to be unlearned. I have recently found in many areas in my life that the biggest successes I've had have been when I've stopped hiding behind a computer screen and made phone calls and personal visits. There is no substitute for "pressing the flesh" as any politician can tell you.

The web is an exclusive and insular place and you're olnlly going to find our generation of techno if you're looking for it. We've got to stop preaching to the converted all the time and start getting out there in peoples faces with it.

Techno promotion is not something 1 person can do and theres too many people trying to go it alone. this is simply not the way. You've got to create a buzz and it takes at least 4 people to get a buzz going.

Co-operation is key. You want this thing to live? you got to work for it and sitting clicking refresh on your browser every 10 minutes counts for sweet F A

[Martin Dust]

i don't know what half of you are on about but the plot has been lost. this isn't about the outside crowd or finding the key to techno. this is about the inside track the producers and label owners/ distirbutors. the people who make techno techno and this board is a bloody microcosm of that.the shitty market in techno for the buyers and sellers is a result of lack of coordinated effort in organization and pompous nepotism. it's bloody anarchy out there and the two faces are running amok. it's a facelss business with no accountability. ask any fledgling label owner if he's ever met anyone remotely connected with selling his record. i'm talking about real accountability for everyone involved. not i made a track last week and it's being put out this week.

these atttudes not only on this board but pan techno are a result of this.

I disagree, I'm out in the clubs, shops and know who sells my stuff and I offer them my support. Sure, it's tough but good records always find a good home I find.

[Martin Dust]

It does look like this thread has been hijacked for people to get stuff off their chest which is fine. I think people are reading the title as "The fututre of BOA forum" somehow.

The way for techno to really improve is to stop relying on the web to get the word out about stuff. People seem to think that the web will do all the work for them when promoting and that just posting the odd flyer on a forum is how it's done. This is a lesson that needs to be unlearned. I have recently found in many areas in my life that the biggest successes I've had have been when I've stopped hiding behind a computer screen and made phone calls and personal visits. There is no substitute for "pressing the flesh" as any politician can tell you.

The web is an exclusive and insular place and you're olnlly going to find our generation of techno if you're looking for it. We've got to stop preaching to the converted all the time and start getting out there in peoples faces with it.

Techno promotion is not something 1 person can do and theres too many people trying to go it alone. this is simply not the way. You've got to create a buzz and it takes at least 4 people to get a buzz going.

Co-operation is key. You want this thing to live? you got to work for it and sitting clicking refresh on your browser every 10 minutes counts for sweet F A

This is absolutely correct, while the net helps, it isn't the complete answer, perhaps this is the biggest mistake people make.

[gunjack]

Surely bitching about some forms of techno being too dark and serious to be classed as techno is going against whats needed here.


don't be daft man, anone who has heard any one of my records knows my style is dark. i wasn't bitching about techno being to dark i was making the point that, just because some of us make darker music than others does not give us the right to look down on folks. maybe try READING the post before you answer a post.



TECHNO IS NOT SOME ARTSY FARTSY outlet for you to show your intellectual superiority, IT IS ENTERTAINMET AND EXPRESSION.

Your opinion dude. And your shouting it from on top of your own high horse.

How come you get to define exactly what techno is and isn't?

Wouldn't it be simpler to accept that techno means different things to different people?

Then we could stop this drama queen routine of complaining and preaching about other people complaining and preaching.

People are always going to have differing opinions. Deal with it.

I think techno should be about connecting with crowds through rhythmn and energy, but this doesn't mean I have to dismiss everything else out of hand.

Room enough in this scene for all of us.



again, maybe try READING the post. that is exactly what i was saying. room enough for all of us and respect enough not to talk down to eachother. BOY FOLKS REALLY DON'T READ BEFORE THEY POST DO THEY?!

[gunjack]

boy what a bunch of rocket surgeons we got up in here eh? :lol:

[eyes without a face]

i think where a person lives has a bearing on their view of current techno, the scene etc etc ... i disagree solid on a few of the points in here, mainly this from Acid

Techno promotion is not something 1 person can do and theres too many people trying to go it alone. this is simply not the way. You've got to create a buzz and it takes at least 4 people to get a buzz going.


i can see your point, definately, but i have to disagree. I do all my own promotion, i get in touch with all the labels, the producers, i build my own bridges and i reap what i sow from this, any promotion of the records or gigs ive harnessed afterwards is down to the discretion of the label owner or club owner

BUT

on the flipside i do agree on the whole that there is a big dividing line between alot of producers and id like to see this erased a little, and all i can feel is that its down to personal problems, people with ego's getting way above themselves, people developing these ego's before your eyes and thus resulting with huge dismay and friction at times, people talking behind your back and then wanting to talk afterwards etc, people forget that there are normal people behind these artists and the same shit that goes down in the workplace, in the factories, between supermarket staff etc goes on between artists, bitching, petty arguments, people getting cliquey..

if people dont see this then thats when there really is a problem, its those that do see it and try to do something about that please me, this thread was great to read before it was hijacked ever so slightly, and i totally get Mark's point, he knows the score definately.

i for one have a group of friends mainly off this board, all producers, that id consider part of an unofficial "group" as it were, nothing official of course that would be a bit odd, but friends who produce, and give critique, and pull me or others down when we get uppity, but i do find that some in that group seem to pull away and ego's take over etc, its a damn damn shame that people with good souls tend to get led of the path somewhat in the ignorant hope of improving their situation in what they do.... but in saying this i like to stand on my own 2 feet, i have strong, solid opinions and i stay true to them, even if it means disagreeing with friends, its a true friend who can take this on board and learn from it...

phew, this is a deep thread when you really get thinking, but the problems there, but i also know people know its time to do something about it

fingers crossed!

[AcidTrash]

I wasw talking about clubs not DJ careers.

[eyes without a face]

its still applicable, i know people who have run clubs on their own and done it well, there's no rule saying you need 4 or more people to get a buzz going, you need a passion and someone willing to work hard thats all

[dan the acid man]

Surely bitching about some forms of techno being too dark and serious to be classed as techno is going against whats needed here.


don't be daft man, anone who has heard any one of my records knows my style is dark. i wasn't bitching about techno being to dark i was making the point that, just because some of us make darker music than others does not give us the right to look down on folks. maybe try READING the post before you answer a post.



my post was more in response to that pm you posted, rather than your posts

again, maybe try READING the post. that is exactly what i was saying. room enough for all of us and respect enough not to talk down to eachother. BOY FOLKS REALLY DON'T READ BEFORE THEY POST DO THEY?![/quote]

[deaf mosaic]

more rocket surgery on my part then ;)

[dan the acid man]

no, i should have made it more clearer by quoting.

anyway back on topic

[Jay Pace]

I still think all techno tracks should include the word "techno" at least once.

Funky tracks should include mandatory slap bass (the undisputed sound of funk)

Hard tracks should have to include a big piece of metal clanking.

More regulation. Fines for noncompliance.

Persistant offenders to be locked in stocks and pelted with fruit.

[MARKEG]

Quote from Adverse:

techno needs an umbrella organization that is subjected to standards of release with real houses for criticism and friendship alike. the failure of any humility on the part of many producers on this board is typical of the kind of people who allow it to go on. and it's nepotistic/clic tendancies are servile to nothing but negativity within the community.

ME:

Have you not been in the Techno Production Forums recently? Everyone helps each other out and tries to be constructive. Great. Humity? No. This is disgusting. Humiliation is wrong. Helpful feedback is right. So you really think humiliation is the way forward? Deary me, I know you better than that Mark. But I do agree with something you said there. We need some quality control on techno for sure and that CAN be achieved with humble feedback ;)


Quote from Martin Dust:

It happens on all forums, but where does it say that we all have to get on or indeed act like dicks? The thing to do is take a long hard look at your input and decide what you want to do. It's no good saying this place sucks without trying to change with some posts or ideas...

ME:

Wow. Someone can see this????!!! We have such a great thing here. Why do ppl always talk about the topics but never think how it affects our community when they go off on one. Why do they never think about the time and effort we've all put in, from mods to posters to me to all of us that have something to say, and at least have a little respect. Adverse tells me in one post that efffectively this community is shit. And so do loads more all the time. Well thanks alot guys, I'm glad I sit up all night and day trying to Admin all this crap. Why not just find another board instead of moaning that this one's shit. Instead, just be constructive. PM me if you find a problem first, then post that our community is shit it's not solved. Surely you can see if I get the board right from the offset, it would be better than firing the whole place up, especially as it's so public. If I'm not doing something which is fueling problems, and it needs to be sorted - I NEED to know. Honest guys, if you have a thought on how to make this place better, please pm me ;)

Dustin:

HAhaha, this discussion again. It's about that time for the monthly techno pep talk I guess. I'm with Adverse, Gunny, and Martin Dust for the most part.

Me:

Well I do think Gunny's post there was great. Adverse? Love ya man but I wish you've stop moaning Hahaha. Martin? Wicked.

Dustin:

While everybody on here pisses and moans and talks about doing something, the rest of the world will move on and offer other alternatives. Maybe not tomorrow or next week, but eventually. That's nature. Spend less time on the web chatting about things you'll never do, quick strokin' each other (95% of the tracks on BOA will not sell guaranteed), and spend more time in the studio. The market hasn't disappeared, it's simply moved on without you or left you in the dust. There is tons of amazing music coming out on the regular, and believe it or not there are still people buying records (mostly minimal at the moment unfortunately). They just want something different. I need to hear another poor Glenn Wilson or Joris Voorn knock-off like I need another hole in my head.

ME:

Me too. But you have to have a balance I think between the moaning and the +ve shit on boards. I think that was Adverse's point slightly. We can't lick each others balls, but I do think it's gone too much the other way recently on here and as the guy who made the god damn board I have to sort this out. I WILL sort this out. Why wake up to a load of moaning and ppl hating each other and the whole world? I don't want this. I too happy in my life to read this. Time to sort this crap out I think. The +ve ppl need to stay and the -ve need to go. Just gimme a week. Radical changes afoot ;)


Acid Trash:

Yeah but if the Mark EG forum isn't a place where we can celebrate tunes made for the floor without being made to feel intelectually or artistically inferior by smug humourless knowitall twunts where the f*ck can we?

ME:

Well it started as my forum but it obviously seems I have lost control somewhere. I only ever wanted a place for those of the same mission to chat and it's developing into something of a techno snobs fighting pit. I think the real key and the only key left on a public internet forum is to be +ve, and if you are going to slate, at least have respect and the community's interests at heart. I have respect for the intellectuals who make techno, just as i have respect for those who make it in a squat. we're all the same - PEOPLE - at the end of the day. Anyway, I have to have a long hard think about this. Anyway, great post. Thanks to Adverse for making it (shame you couldn't have worded it slightly different though cause it's not exactly doing alot for our community is it ya bugger)



Adverse:

don't know what half of you are on about but the plot has been lost. this isn't about the outside crowd or finding the key to techno. this is about the inside track the producers and label owners/ distirbutors. the people who make techno techno and this board is a bloody microcosm of that.the shitty market in techno for the buyers and sellers is a result of lack of coordinated effort in organization and pompous nepotism. it's bloody anarchy out there and the two faces are running amok. it's a facelss business with no accountability. ask any fledgling label owner if he's ever met anyone remotely connected with selling his record. i'm talking about real accountability for everyone involved. not i made a track last week and it's being put out this week.

these atttudes not only on this board but pan techno are a result of this.


ME:

Mate, I could have told you this 4 years ago. But this is now a totally different subject to the one you posted. This is really what is wrong with techno and any form of underground music. No accountability. No business sense. No quality control. Agree 100%. But there are ppl out there, like Martin, who are thinking bigger and better than the majority. And I applaude that. But we all have to learn and we all have to start somewhere. It's all a learning process. If you're running your own business you live by your own rules eh and make them up and you go. Martin's learnt what he's learn from years of trying. So have I. So there's always gonna be ppl who don't know what they're doing in underground music. Quit moaning and get to the top of the tree and then make your difference. Prob is in techno we only have 10% at the top and 90% learning. We need to encourage those 90%, not knock them for knowing nothing.

Anyway ppl, some big changes need to be made here. Anything that concerns the future of techno concerns the future of this forum in my eyes. OK that's enough ranting from me. Sorry about the mistakes, I'm a bit tired. Please PM me with your thoughts on what I should do for the forum to make it better if you get time ;)

[Adverse]

you think i'm moaning.. this is reality mark. and the fact that you just said yourself that nobody knows the true nature of what has been happening i just cause for "moaning". if you want to call it that. this was well intentioned topic and if you can't see that then the line of positivity has been blurred.

secondly learning HUMILITY not HUMILIATION.. is an important fact of life... and upon these forums lately there is a total lack of it. i would never humiliate anyone trying to express themselves. learning humility in criticism BEING HUMBLE. nevermind that it's gotten to the point of total backwashing it doesn't even matter who's gotten talent or vision anymore.

anyways.

respect to martin.

[Adverse]

nevermind that it's gotten to the point of total backwashing it doesn't even matter who's gotten talent or vision anymore..

i meant in the techno production forum.

[basslinejunkie]

something ive spotted recently is people over-reacting,or taking themselves or even the music or the issues they raise to seriously.why do we love techno? because its fun.everyone seems to be picking the bones out of it recently,concentrating on the bad rather than the good.

some of gunjacks early posts in this topic were 100per cent spot on for me,i mean the guy ( a fellow techno lover) posts in the promo section that hes got a new realese planned which hes obviously chuffed about,and people start to sharpen their knives.i can totally understand why he flipped.

anywayz,i think theres to much ego/testosterone flyin around this place at the moment.

im here because i love the music simple as that.i do all i can for the future of techno by buying the records i like.

[Dustin Zahn]

Quote from Adverse:
Dustin:

HAhaha, this discussion again. It's about that time for the monthly techno pep talk I guess. I'm with Adverse, Gunny, and Martin Dust for the most part.

Me:

Well I do think Gunny's post there was great. Adverse? Love ya man but I wish you've stop moaning Hahaha. Martin? Wicked.

Dustin:

While everybody on here pisses and moans and talks about doing something, the rest of the world will move on and offer other alternatives. Maybe not tomorrow or next week, but eventually. That's nature. Spend less time on the web chatting about things you'll never do, quick strokin' each other (95% of the tracks on BOA will not sell guaranteed), and spend more time in the studio. The market hasn't disappeared, it's simply moved on without you or left you in the dust. There is tons of amazing music coming out on the regular, and believe it or not there are still people buying records (mostly minimal at the moment unfortunately). They just want something different. I need to hear another poor Glenn Wilson or Joris Voorn knock-off like I need another hole in my head.

ME:

Me too. But you have to have a balance I think between the moaning and the +ve shit on boards. I think that was Adverse's point slightly. We can't lick each others balls, but I do think it's gone too much the other way recently on here and as the guy who made the god damn board I have to sort this out. I WILL sort this out. Why wake up to a load of moaning and ppl hating each other and the whole world? I don't want this. I too happy in my life to read this. Time to sort this crap out I think. The +ve ppl need to stay and the -ve need to go. Just gimme a week. Radical changes afoot ;)

First off, I thought their posts were great. That's why I chose to respond. My comment towards the thread title was simply because it seems there is one of these every other week.

I hope you do sort things out. When I first discovered BOA I thought it was a very good read.

I'm just finding it humorous that people sit around talk about making things happen yet they never do. These are the same people making/DJing nearly direct clones of material that has been done to death. My point was, stop talking and start doing.

[dirty_bass]

something ive spotted recently is people over-reacting,or taking themselves or even the music or the issues they raise to seriously.why do we love techno? because its fun.everyone seems to be picking the bones out of it recently,concentrating on the bad rather than the good.

some of gunjacks early posts in this topic were 100per cent spot on for me,i mean the guy ( a fellow techno lover) posts in the promo section that hes got a new realese planned which hes obviously chuffed about,and people start to sharpen their knives.i can totally understand why he flipped.

anywayz,i think theres to much ego/testosterone flyin around this place at the moment.

im here because i love the music simple as that.i do all i can for the future of techno by buying the records i like.

well this was also unprovoked



dirty_bass wrote:
How cool is this?
Good to see a top bod removing the barrier of clique to open the doors to diversity and art.
Respect.
clap



dude, why don't you just crawl up glenns arse and get it over with?


but I just didn`t make a huge song and a dance about the whole affair.
But no one leapt to my defence.

So all is fair in love and war.

Can we get over it now please.

[gunjack]

oh god steeve, GROW UP. you were obviously antagonizing me. there i was, i was obviously stoked about my new release and you were just F UCKING WITH ME WHEN YOU ARE SUPPOSED TO BE A MODERATOR.


dude, did you really need to bring this up again when we have a vex thread going? :eh:

[DJAmok]

mark eg:
techno snob fighting pit



nuff said :clap:






why is everyone so pissed off these days? :neutral:

[gunjack]

seriously, dirty bass, i am done fighting with you about this. your attitude speaks for itself. i may get worked up from time to time, but you are an asshole 24/7. really, WHO DO YOU THINK YOU ARE?! bassline junkie didn't take a shot at you, he just said he understood where i was coming from, are you so petty that you couldn't even bear that?


as for the TOPIC (this is your board to moderate i might add not to derail threads) - i gotta agree with adverse on this one. biggie smalls said - "i try to treat every project as if it was my first and just stay humble" i think that is a good philosophy

:rambo:

[dirty_bass]

Sorry dude, I wasn`t fighting with you, my comment wasn`t aimed at provoking you at all, I was just adding a little perspective to the situation.
Erm as for hijacking threads.
I think you were first to do that in this thread.
Not that it matters, the points have been made.


Getting on a serious matter.

If any cat does need any musical legal advice then please get onto me and I can put you in touch with my mate, just spoke to him again about it, and he is very willing to help out for free with any legal stuff for the independant scene.
So if you are looking at a deal and are about to sign a license or something, talk to the guy, he can give you very straight and learned advice.
Also copyright and publishing and stuff, same deal.

[tocsin]

I'm also always down with offering legal advice, at least as US shit is concerned. I'm a lawyer so I can help out in this respect here and there.

[dirty_bass]

Yeah, the US does have some rather differing laws in this matter, you do have to be careful about making legal presumptions based on US, and euro law in regards to copyright and licensing.

[tocsin]

Have you not been in the Techno Production Forums recently? Everyone helps each other out and tries to be constructive. Great. Humity? No. This is disgusting. Humiliation is wrong. Helpful feedback is right. So you really think humiliation is the way forward? Deary me, I know you better than that Mark. But I do agree with something you said there. We need some quality control on techno for sure and that CAN be achieved with humble feedback wink

I can agree with you up to a certain point here, Mark. Yes, Everyone should offer their "honest" feedback. And, when it's done in a fair manner, I do appreciate the "positive" (or, as I read it "constructive") rles that are enforced here. But, at the same time, to any aspiring producer (of which I consider myself one) just remember that opinions on this board don't amount to anything more than that. Itseems too many people get way too touchy over feedback and, after a short matter of time, people on many sides turn into raging pricks about it. "Quality" is subjective. The style of music I work on is, for the most part, not anything anyone here would consider quality. At the same time, the niche market it would sell to also wouldn't consider it "quality." So, I guess all I'm saying is, to anyone who might take criticism here to heart, also don't write off the fact that you may have written something that the people who criticize it just can't relate to. For myself, at one point in time, every "techno" track fell into this category. And, as of 1994-95, I did a complete reversal. While you may just be writing crap, there is also the very real possibility that you are either ahead of your time or just appealing to an incredibly small niche market.

[tocsin]

Yeah, the US does have some rather differing laws in this matter, you do have to be careful about making legal presumptions based on US, and euro law in regards to copyright and licensing.

Absolutely. The stance that the US took in the WIPO treaty was kinda disappointing. When it comes down to it, artists have more protection in Europe than in the US in certain regards. Then, at the same time, corporations alkso have a different degree of protection, which supposedly are in artists' interests, but often aren't.

[The Overfiend]

http://www.blackoutaudio.co.uk/phpBB2/viewtopic.php?t=39070

[tocsin]

^^^ No that I don't feel where you are coming from. But, really, I'd like to see "techno" go back to the era where sampling was not a taboo. Some of the best music came out then, in my opinion, largely due to the fact that nobody cared about industry related mandates. It fit in with the hacker ethic hich didn't believe that laws should prevent someone from perfecting something. That was one of the themes I found in techno that appealed to me the most. A good deal of techno tracks that illegally samlped other tracks, in my opinion, made better tracks with the samples, than the original did.

[Martin Dust]

I feel that one of the key points being made here and one that is being missed is how the or this techno community seems to always turn in on itself.

This will happens when people hold strong views but it seems to happen here a lot. I guess what people are asking for is for us all to be a bit more understanding of each others music and views. It's not that hard when you think about it. I didn't see the Gunjack thread but I know what it feels like to get a promo out and I'd guess he's be pretty darn chuffed. Now, even if I didn't like the music, I'd be pretty darn chuffed for him. I like to see people happy and it's cool as **** when people make progress.

Dirty B, right, the thing is mate you keep banging on about some next level shit and how you what to do much more but it's time to put up or shut up because if you can't see that it's winding people up then you need to take a step back and have a good look at what it looks like to others, you need to be able to see that it sounds and looks like one big diss and that nothing is good enough. I'm willing to chat about this some more if you wish but mate, give it a rest with the next level shit and just bring it.

There's some great people here and knowhere does it say we are all going to get along but it's important that you show respect to other peoples work. I like the whole spectrum of techno and people are often puzzled that I can be in both System 23 and Black Dog, but to me it makes perfect sense - I ****ing love watching people go mental and getting off on stuff and then I like to chill back and **** with your head. I've spent a lot of time in clubs and even when I haven't liked the music, I have enjoyed watching the DJ or the crowd go for it, I guess I'm not that much of a snob when it comes to having a good time.

My answer to all this would be to start posting new stuff you want to talk about or care about, the only way forward is with more hard work. Lets not get caught in the trap that often happens on forums...

Hope that makes some sense.....

[The Overfiend]

I am beyond sad.
No other words for it.
I am not going to sit here and say what is correct or what is wrong
with techno.
I am going to admit what I have done personally what I feel was wrong on my part.
I am wrong to wear my heart on my sleeve and display anger.
I was wrong to bring my anger with anyone I have had any confrontation with and make it a public issue.
I was wrong for being so passionate about something I believe in.
I do not know how to be any other way. Yes I wear my heart on my sleeve. It is my nature of conditioning. I cannot help that I can only hope
to be a better person in business and in a music sense. I first came to this forum in hopes to be able to share thoughts with like minds. While I have done so. Seems we have also had some disagreements along the way. Though I have come off as a brute in most, I am quite the opposite and have a big heart in fact. Anyone who knows me personally will know this is true. I am appaled at what is going on in the forum lately, but also cannot help but to feel responsible for some of it. I agree whole heartedly with Mark Eg's Points in the Future Thread. I also agree with most other members points here and there. I am seriously upset to be part of some recent quarrels at hand. I am also upset to see very good friends of mine fighting, really fighting. I am more than apologetic if I in anyway have brought upon any events causing any of this to happen.
I am choosing to be humble because all the war, and the bitterness and the fighting is not why I choose to be part of this place. I choose to moderate because I felt I can make a difference and really add a new attitude and input to this forum and to techno in general really. I hope I have done a good job. I am sorry if I have not. I am not a babysitter. Or a justice of the peace. I can only help the tone. I extend my deepest humilities to Mark, I've tried man, I swear it. Anyone who I have offended or turned off, please don't let my convictions or random bursts of ignorance dismay you from this place. It is the greatest forum there is, and I owe everything to it. Even my present life. I have made the best friends I have ever had from here. I love people I have met here. Whatever happens from here on in. Is in the hands of Mark. I will stay if only Eg and everyone else would have it that way. I hope this does not bring me any flak as I am only being honest and real. So hopefully this quote has a positive result. If not then like I said it is my heart in my hands.

Cheers,
Antonio

From The Heart In My Hands Post

[Sunil]

My answer to all this would be to start posting new stuff you want to talk about or care about, the only way forward is with more hard work. Lets not get caught in the trap that often happens on forums...

.....

Been there, done that. It didn't work.

[Martin Dust]

Are you sure Sunil, it would only take 5 or 6 people to turn this thing around. Are you saying that you feel that it's not worth it?

What do you think needs to change?

If anything good is to come out of this then it's clear things need to change, so - cards on the table....

[Sunil]

Are you sure Sunil, it would only take 5 or 6 people to turn this thing around. Are you saying that you feel that it's not worth it?

What do you think needs to change?

If anything good is to come out of this then it's clear things need to change, so - cards on the table....

Maybe for a littlw while, but in the long term I wouldn't be so sure.

I've tried talking about what I thought was good techno, or even stuff that I thought was next level. And rarely would anything get going.

Also, in the last number of months I've found myself vehemently defending producers who have really made a difference... Adam Beyer, Jeff Mills, Chris McCormack etc.

I could go on for a bit here but I may leave it for another time, and nor do I want to create a big deal. Right now I just feel a bit soured towards the place, I don't really feel like part of a community, still a bit like an outsider whose opinion or input isn't really necessary.

[Mirsha]

I get that feeling all the time, it's very easy for someones opinion to be vasty overlooked, especially on these forums where we do see a lot of posters who are people out there doing shit who's opinions will always trump the folk who aren't doing shit. At least this community doesn't scare off people form posting as I've seen on other forums.

For me BOA is deinately not the place for me to discuss the music which burns in the icy black heart of my soul, but this comes down far more about what I'm into and what the vast majority of people are into. It doesn't stop me from occasionly pokin gmy oar into various topics though. At the end of the day though I'm not really looking for terribly much from these forums apart from a bit of banter and a bit of a laugh as well as picking up production related information.

[Martin Dust]

Shame you feel that way Sunil...

[RDR]

You guys are crazy :)

99.9 of the crowd aren't on BOA, wonder what they're doing - I bet they aint moaning or looking for the "key" to techno.

Judge me by my releases and what comes out of the speakers, I'm there for myself and the crowd, simple as.

Agreed.

I Like writing techno and electro and house and ambient.. (although im not interesting in wrintg trance.. hahahah) and dowtempo and electronic dub etc...

I like talking to people on here. Its fun and informative. Im not ready to "Leave" the scene, nor do i think this board is the be all and end all.

As for the idea about a techno uber-coolische-stamp type organisation affair... Nah. There are so many things wrong ith that idea i dont know where to begin (IMO of course)

Personal attacks are wrong here - ****ing hell, if ya wanna get personal get to know the person (Then sock em in the mush if ya really dont like em..)

Learn, Evolve, Enjoy.

Dont

Fight, Destroy, Ignore.

Love ya all (Even Brian - some good points there mate, respect)

[MARKEG]

total shame. really is. something has to be done. if ppl like sunhil are saying they don't feel their input is needed (and i'm sure he's one of quite a few) then we all have to address this, especially me. the more i think about it, if we took all the ppl who jump down each other's throats out of here, actually have a really great place imho. just cause you're a big producer, or run several labels, or are good at staying up late in front of your computer, doesn't mean you're always right. and it doesn't also give you the right to be an ass.

leave this with me, i'll make some big changes today. some ppl wont like, some ppl will, but i really think that now this is out in the open, we have to address it asap.

[Jimfish]

I'm the same sunil, which is a shame because you seemed one of the most on-my-level sorta guys on here when i used to bother with it.

I must admit though i gave up trying to bring up any discussions a long time ago, partly because im a lazy c.unt but also because it all just seemed rather pointless.

Unfortunatly this place has been going around in circles for over a year now, its like a f.ucking bad trip. Even from the outside i cant see how you can slow the inertia that is driving it around let alone reverse it. And the usual 'be +VE' solution has just become a part of the loop.

For me its not about the positivity or negativity, its just about people being so anal and/or dramatic about things (things that really dont matter in the bigger picture), just chill out!. Also the strokin' (as zahn so wonderfully puts it) is a bit nausiating - unless someones strokin' me ;) hehe . But anyway, these things are just human nature, and that aint gonna change, just like outside of this board you arent going to turn a load of technoheads into businessmen.

[Jimfish]

theres a whoe world out there guys, it just seems crazy to get so up tight about such tiny insignificant things. Im sure if everyone just got on with it, chilled out, and stopped analyzing everything so damn much then things would be better for the scene.

gay analogy i know but its like if you juggle you have to just let go and trust your hands to catch each ball. If you think too much about it you drop the balls - everytime gauranteed. Im saying just go with it, and enjoy it!

[RDR]

just like outside of this board you arent going to turn a load of technoheads into businessmen.

Well said Jim.

Nice to hear your voice again (Stroke, Stroke.. ;) :lol: )

although to be honest i think the problem IS that a load of techno heads turned into business men.

[Jimfish]

yeah baby you like that?

[RDR]

yeah baby you like that?

Oh yeah! Uh Huh, Oh Yeah! Uh Huh!

[davethedrummer]

i don't really want to get too involved in this discussion as i really can't see any light at the end of the tunnel for it.
( we have been here many times this year )
some good points have been made here and there
but it's all very depressing really.
i think some of you guys need to lighten up a bit .
come on chaps......it's just a forum , if you want to change something then do it , and post it up here so people can see it and be encouraged by it.
new labels , new clubs , new artwork , dvd ideas , interactive music etc etc
all we do is bang on about mp3 vs vinyl or how things aint as good as they used to be these days. can we get over this already?

i think everyone needs to relax their opinions about what techno is in the first place. it's obvious that electronic music in general is feeling it's age and needs a bit of a shake up , but moaning about it will only slow the process down , as will spending time on internet forums discussing what we want to be doing , as opposed to just doing it and then sharing it with others:
"look what i just done" etc etc .............
as opposed to:
"the reason i'm pissed off today is.........."

there is plenty of humility here i think. yeah sure sometimes people get arsey and opinionated but then it is an ongoing discussion so that's bound to happen , and anyway, other people all over the world take their music very seriously
from classical to jazz to folk music to rockn'roll ,enthusiasts everywhere are the same , passionate.
we really shouldn't get so uptight about people being passionate there's nothing wrong with it , and there's nothing a little humour now and again can't cure.

"insert favorite joke here"

anyway what the hell do i know about it?
i'm too busy snorting ketamine at squat parties and dribbling on myself
apparently, according to one guy on here the other day.
something like that anyway. ( unbelievable!!!!he should be ashamed of himself)

so my point?
i don't have one , and you know what?
i don't need one , i just like to have discussions with people, to keep my mind sharp and to learn new things ,

now where did i put that 303?........

;)

[RDR]

:shifty: I'd better get on with that
Electronic symphony using casio's, speak n spells and me watkins copycat...

Nice one DTD... nail,. head, hit , on , the you.

As usual.

Respect.

[Mindful]

I don't really feel like part of a community, still a bit like an outsider whose opinion or input isn't really necessary.

No way man to me your one of the people whos imput allways strikes a note with me.
Your opinion or input is very necessery to this place man imo



I could go on one on this topic cause I have loads of feelings on this but im going to restrain myself cause certain people have allready said along the lines what I could add.

I will say tho and echo what Henry has said and that is that this place could benifit from us all chilling out and stop taking it all so serius(alltho I take my music very serius personally)
We all like different ellements of music and disscussion and dissagreement is importent but not as importent as respecting other peoples takes on things.

Lets all have a group rub

[AcidTrash]

It's a dark day when DAVE isn't sure where his 303 is!! :lol:

[massplanck]

gay analogy i know but its like if you juggle you have to just let go and trust your hands to catch each ball. If you think too much about it you drop the balls - everytime gauranteed.

:clap:

Quote of the afternoon. ;)

[Jimfish]

dont, it made me cringe enough when i wrote it! ;)

[Sunil]

No way man to me your one of the people whos imput allways strikes a note with me.
Your opinion or input is very necessery to this place man imo


Thanks man. Good to see you back in here too Jimfish ;)

I know not everyone has been following techno as long as I have, and I know that there's others who have been following it for longer than I have. I guess I like to feel a lot in common with people here be it through shared opinions or experiences on the music, producers, records, or clubscene... things that make me feel that others share the same spirit within techno that I do too. This all came from somewhere, and I still have Chicago, New York, Cologne, Gent, Rotterdam, Brighton, Detroit, London, Stockholm or wherever! running through my techno veins as it were. It's all important, relevant, part of the equation, be it old or new. Rarely do I feel a unified respect of these sort of things, and that to me is a big part of the techno spirit.

Yeah, generally I like to participate here. I like talking about techno through the ages though, from the early days through to now.. the big picture. No head numbing evolution of techno conversations, because that hasn't happened yet, you talk about that stuff after the transition of where we're at now, or when those new defining records come along. Techno can't be forced forward through a thread on BOA, at this stage I think all it can do is change a bit, and hopefully for the better. I don't think it's all doom and gloom, but I think everyone needs to be quicker to sort the wheat from the chaff and to do their best to wholeheartedly support that, be it through buying the record, going to the gig (dragging your mates along!), reviewing the music, or even emailing that producer or label to say they like their music... every little bit helps these days, it really does. And if there's no great records out there, then no hassle, no-one has to pretend that there are.

Personally I think the message board thing is a hinderence in many ways, but still a bit of fun all the same.

[eyes without a face]

the thing with message boards is they dont convey the real meaning behind alot of posts, i can guarentee some of us on here would get on alot better if we could say these things face to face

[Martin Dust]

Face to face, people wouldn't say half the shit they do...

[dan the acid man]

Face to face, people wouldn't say half the shit they do...

yeah they would, smelly face :lol:

[eyes without a face]

Face to face, people wouldn't say half the shit they do...

well thats a personal issue for the people in question, whoever they maybe. i would have no qualms about saying anything to anyone's face in the context we are talkin about here, literaly unless the person was standing there with a gun pointed at me, id probably curb my words somewhat then

[Martin Dust]

What's the weather like up there ;)

[eyes without a face]

very warm, but dull and rainy too, not my favourite weather, i prefer it cold and rainy

unrelated but your System 23 has grown on me dude, props, sometimes these things take a while with me haha

[eyes without a face]

there should be an "ep" in there obviously hehe

[The Divide]

Back to the topic (which was titled the future but is more about whats letting this board/the techno scene down) ...

Firstly this board, I don't care too much about the threads which go on about 'next level' or new ideas because for me anyways, its not what I'm looking for in techno. If anything I would like the opposite and for things to step back away from busy drum based structures which simply accumulate then disperse. If there will be another revolution, it will be within the music and its makers itself and the only thing any forum can do is acknowledge this 'next level' and thats that. But I couldn't see any of that happening and don't really care if doesn't.

As for this form not been a strong enough community? I think thats in eye of the beholder really, I mean I know personally that my experience with this board proves otherwise. Shit Im even living with someone I met on this board. I have met some really good people on here (you know who you are) outside of the forum. I think most the people including yourself mark, know that setting aside all the cussin thats been going on there still is a good community and always has been

But...

Well my main gripe is the negativity on here. I don't really get it personally. I'm really happy about the way things are changing within the music scene. I mean when in history has anyone been able to make a track and stick it on t'internet and have it travel the world in a matter of seconds. I am actually hoping the digital thing really takes off. Right now, its in its baby stages and has its problems. In the long run I can see a complete overhaul of the current structure and that for me is exciting as it will knock down things I see as boundaries. I don't really see any need for quality control. Thats all down to those who play out/buy/download the music. I don't listen to what I don't like, thats my quality control. People need to face upto the fact that there are a lot of people out there trying to be an artist with software 'revolution' and all

Also the post locking thing as said previously is really pointless as its just leaving debates unresolved. The thing is by the time some people see some of these posts its too late as its locked. Its usually happening on some controversial thread about issues which are really important too (bar the occasional exception). This is usually down to a heated debate when people get angry and say some shit. Where theres passion theres anger, you cant separate the two. Most people see heated debates as a negative when all it is does is confirm that we are human. Locking posts just lets it all build up

Also I think the banning of people isn't always a good idea (unless its someone who's out to blatantly cause shit then theres no need in putting up with it). Some of the more interesting people on this board got banned, some of which really grew on me

So anyways, as for the future. Well, I'm feeling optimistic but I'm going to see Rob Hood dj tonight and thats what its really all about for me

[grain]

I'm really happy about the way things are changing within the music scene. I mean when in history has anyone been able to make a track and stick it on t'internet and have it travel the world in a matter of seconds. I am actually hoping the digital thing really takes off. Right now, its in its baby stages and has its problems. In the long run I can see a complete overhaul of the current structure and that for me is exciting as it will knock down things I see as boundaries. I don't really see any need for quality control. Thats all down to those who play out/buy/download the music. I don't listen to what I don't like, thats my quality control.

I agree...

I'm only new here... while I'd heard of this forum a long time ago, I only just got broadband, and I'm quickly getting sucked in.. It's only when you have personal internet access that you really get the benefits of the technology.... and it wont be long before absolutely everone has this... which is amazing and revolutionary and yes, certainly only in it's infancy...
But there is certainly bright futures ahead and.. - what's the title of this post? - The Future of Techno... that's it. I think a couple of heads went off on a slightly negative tangent there.. Voicing negativity about negativity?

I think the future of techno is bright (even the really dark stuff!) But it depends on people being creative, experimental, passionate, dynamic.. And it demands that those involved are positive and helpful, even when they need to be critical... Putting forward ideas and solutions, rather than simply voicing dissagreements and dissapointments...
I mean, obviously there are people out there making terrible shite that you wouldn't even call techno... and there's more and more people realising that you can track out a few loops on your computer and burn it to cd and try to call it music, but don't worry about them... If they're not being creative with it, they're not making techno!.... So they have nothing to do with the Future of Techno!... If you catch anyone at this, either ignore them or, if you think they just need a few pointers, say, "check out this music at htttp:// whatever is proper techno", and let them go on their way, knowing you just did something positive...

... but have no fear, there are people out there fighting the good fight, and the more shite music is out there, the more thier music will shine like diamonds in the rough... The Divide is right about the quality control.. YOU are the quality control!!

The future of techno? Sure, techno is the future - always has been, always will be.

[dan the acid man]

yeah, good points, especially the fact that the punters are the quality control, ive always said this, if you dont like it, dont buy it