mp3's-publicity or piracy part 2

[basslinejunkie]

ok,i posted this topic last year i think,and the majority of people said they viewed mp3's as a good tool for promotion.but have your views changed since the explosion of mp3's avalible nowadays?? mine have slightly,i must admit.

maybe its hindering attendancys at events,i mean nowadays you can sit in the confort of your own home an download an listen to virtually any dj you fancy,free of charge.obviously mp3's dont come close to actually being there and witnessing it 1st hand,but il bet alot of ppl think theyl just save the cash an download the set from the night instead.

also just recently ive heard of a few dj's clamping down on there sets being avalible from gigs theyve played,and i can kinda understand why coz of the reason above.

what do you slags think????? :rambo:

[Miromiric]

i love it. so much music i would not have acces to at all if there were no internet. but since people are so gay, it often comes down to a `who`s father has more mp3s on harddisk` competition. listening to some album once while chatting to some 14yrs old in ICQ chatroom and convincing her that putting bottle up her pussy is OK is not really listening to music.

[JamieBall]

Um..... Interesting point :tongue:

[holotropik]

Crikey!! Miro, you have a way with words.....eeek!!

This issue is a real fence-sitter. I sometimes like the MP3 thing and other times agree that its prolly preventing the personal connection between artist and listener. Most article I read about this topic do favour the view that its good promotion which equal ticket/CD sales etc. Which makes sense.

The whole issue of less numbers through doors has to do with something else I reckon.

[djshiva]

i have to say networks like slsk and just posting sets online have been invaluable for me in terms of promotion. i do always encourage people to buy the records to keep the companies alive, but i know how much promotion shared mp3s has gotten me, so it's a double-edged sword really.

we have the ability to share music with people who may not have heard it before, which is great, but there are always those who have the money to buy it and don't because they can download it, which sucks.

[teknorich]

I´m all for it personally. There are a lot of Dj´s who I have discovered by simply trawling around the internet and taking people´s recommendations. I would never have listened to them otherwise, as they were total unknowns, but because they had promo sets or live mixes available I downloaded, found I liked it, and thus stuck with that dj in future. As for downloading a set instead of going to the club to save a bit of cash - are you crazy?! I´ve never done that and I never would. Listening to it on my ipod is noting like going to see the dj live in a club. I don´t see that as an issue myself.

Leeching tracks from soulseek is obviously damaging for the artists, as nobody gets paid, but it can also be publicity. Again, I´ve discovered artists by browsing people´s files. If I am d/ling from a guy on soulseek I´ll browse his files to see what else he has, as it is probably similar. Then, if I really like a track, I´ll often end up buying it from beatport etc to get a good quality version. A lot of stuff on soulseek is ripped from vinyl, and the qualtiy sucks!

So yeah, I don´t see that the artists lose a lot form mp3s. They gain free publicity, and also get to reach a wider audience, as people are more likely to try it out if it is free!!

[The Divide]

i love it. so much music i would not have acces to at all if there were no internet. but since people are so gay, it often comes down to a `who`s father has more mp3s on harddisk` competition. listening to some album once while chatting to some 14yrs old in ICQ chatroom and convincing her that putting bottle up her pussy is OK is not really listening to music.

http://www.fat-pie.com/spoilsminus2.htm

[mrbishi]

At the end of the day Mp3 is the best thing that could have happened in dance music you get the likes of Tidy bitching about their sets been uploaded and shared around the net etc but tbh its only helping in promotion for events, dj booking most important of all record sales the number of people who hear a track played out then dl it too in a liveset 6 months before the release date only gets them quizing more about the name of the producer the remixer the track title the label etc, don't get me wrong theres some people who do abuse it.
I don't like the fact you can widley get mp3 vinyl rips of brand new stuff I think it should be left alone but theres myths going round you earn thousands of pounds in a few hours work djing they think you can afford it lol what these people dont realise is not every producer dj's so vinyl and production are their only income - Ahhhh its a hard one to argue so many good point sso many bad, I think the situation should be just left alone like I said the promotion is all free people who can't club due to age restrictions who love the music still get a peice of the scene and are our future, if we cut these peeps out of the loop everything goes to shit

[Jay Pace]

Music, film, tv and everything form of media is going to end up format-free.

Because having to buy a specific device to play a specific format is a pain in the arse.

MP3 is just the start of a bigger movement to end the distribution of media through pieces of plastic.

[stjohn]

i love it. so much music i would not have acces to at all if there were no internet. but since people are so gay, it often comes down to a `who`s father has more mp3s on harddisk` competition. listening to some album once while chatting to some 14yrs old in ICQ chatroom and convincing her that putting bottle up her pussy is OK is not really listening to music.

http://www.fat-pie.com/spoilsminus2.htm

u so crayzee

[MARKEG]

i love it. so much music i would not have acces to at all if there were no internet. but since people are so gay, it often comes down to a `who`s father has more mp3s on harddisk` competition. listening to some album once while chatting to some 14yrs old in ICQ chatroom and convincing her that putting bottle up her pussy is OK is not really listening to music.

http://www.fat-pie.com/spoilsminus2.htm

bloody hell!

:shock: :lol:

[audioinjection]

so what the hell were we all doing before there were mp3s? :P

[Jay Pace]

so what the hell were we all doing before there were mp3s? :P

Don't know bout you, but I was stting on my bottle.

:shock:

[dan the acid man]

i was taking thos bottle back to the corner shop to get my 2 p return money :lol:

[dan the acid man]

http://www.fat-pie.com/spoilsminus2.htm

i thought his salad fingers was weird, but this takes it to another level :shock:

[basslinejunkie]

so what the hell were we all doing before there were mp3s? :P

buying more music.thats my point.

[holotropik]

precisely......oh dear!!

So now we have reached this point, what is next? Why are we painted into a corner by a format?? What is next?? What is the road you see that musicians must take next...??

Is it simply now about localised pockets building their own networks their own way and evolving to suit a local environment?? What of the current big money spinners who still get to play and release stuff to the masses?? Are they really making that much money?? or is it just hype in order to make you feel you must have their music in order to feel "part of the movement"??

I avent bought any music for ages. I dont like any of the released stuff and most of the DJ sets let me know whats going on anyway....why pay for stuff I can have for free?? See my point? I like the unreleased stuff because it is closer to the bone and true meaning of what that particular artist is trying to say before it gets watered down to become some mainstream fodder for nuffies who only listen to music when they are farked up on drugs.....

.......all these questions and what ifs. Time will tell I suppose?? If we have enough of that left.

[The Divide]

I dont think it matters too much me personally. If artists are genuine they will struggle to get by if they have to. There was once a time when music had no format and didnt make any money (in ye olde worlde). Perhaps heading back that way

What do you mean by 'if we have enough of that left'?

[The Overfiend]

so what the hell were we all doing before there were mp3s? :P

Going out to frickin clubs when our fave dj/producer came around. Specially here in the states.

[Tom @ Religion]

MP3's are effecting the record industry... there's no way you can say otherwise. Smaller run labels releases have become fewer and further between as it's just too much of a gamble for them. This in turn is changing the scene, as more and more dj/producers hold back and trade their tracks between artists in return for other fresh material.

The whole DJ scene is changing into more of a "produce or die" scenario. I'm not sure if I can say "If you're not producing you're not original" cos you obviously can be, but you get my point.

With MP3's all DJ's should take pride in putting out the best quality sound they can, nothing sounds better than a brand new vinyl, not even a CD. But a lot of DJ's don't care, most are young and probably do it cos they don't have the money etc. I've seen people post sets and then get quizzed about where they got all the unreleased tracks to which they don't answer...

It will never be stopped, people will always want freedom to have/share/copy whatever they like whether it's illegal or not.

IMO the internet is the best and worst thing that ever happened to the music world. It has effected the scene in a bad way, but also helped the smaller sounds spread and a lot of talented new producers get noticed...

[eyeswithoutaface]

yeah, thats a good point, the internet has been the best and possibly the worst thing at the same time for music. The trick is finding a halfway house i think. Without the internet i wouldnt be in the position i am now, so i have alot to thank it for. I dont run a label and never intend to, so i wouldnt feel the pinch of mp3's in that sense. And anyone who wants to steal any of my mp3's should know better, because if they just contacted me id happily send them some high quality mp3's instead of any ripped one's they've found, not that there are many of mine but you get the point, i dont use music as my sole income which i know alot of people do, or certainly try to, and to be honest i think alot of people are a bit niave in this sense. People say "oh but you cant get into production seriously with a full time job" etc etc, which is true to an extent, but hundreds of people manage to work their way around it so im sure others can.

Alot of people need to stop viewing mp3 and the internet as a direct threat and embrace it more, utilise what's on offer and get ready for what's going to be on offer in the future. Ive sorted out my first mp3 release with a label in Spain and im looking forward to it when i finally get the tracks finished after christmas and new year

[Tom @ Religion]

But... like everything in this world. If people can abuse it, and get away with it, they will... until it's all ****ed up. But they won't care, what damage does one person do eh? But it can't be stopped. So I dunno why I'm ranting... *sigh* Talent & innovation should be rewarded.

Good luck with your tracks btw!!

[The Divide]

I think the internet is shaking up a fairly stagment industry, I dont really think piracy abuse has been that influential in the recent decline of sales. I think its down to other factors = changes in consumer behavior, social change, weak releases, saturated market and the dj's who daren’t play something a little obscure than your average 5 min loop

As for the wider commercial music industry (as it was brought up), well more and more people are downloading music legitimately and its growing fast. People have started to disassociate must from a format (2 very different things) and this so called commercial music 'recession' or 'decline in sales' turned out to be **** all in compared to the millions it makes. Go into your local HMV and you’ll see no sign of no recession there, infact from what I have been told sales of music is going up. Its been proven that people who download music actually spent £3-4 a month more than those who don’t download music yet these debates still seem to crop up.

We can go on about how the mp3 raped techno but for me its one of those arguments thats makes little or no sense to me. Do people think the mp3 stopped young people from getting into the scene. I don’t think so yet when I got out these days all I see is old faces. I don’t really believe that people stopped buying records simply because it was on the web as an mp3. Mixes may have had a knock on effect is it much different that going out and buying your annual tape pack as at the end of the day the artist got **** all back then. So for me it would make more sense not to blame the mp3 for anything and just accept the fact that people are changing their ideas, something which I welcome as things were starting to bore my cock off. I am not worried the slightest as music will never die! I just think its about time that people adapted instead of living in the past.

imo

[audioinjection]

what about all the people who arent online? i dont think all techno heads are geeks and they don't browse around online looking for the latest speedy j and liebing sets......people are still putting out mixed cd's and vinyl so there must be some sort of market for that right?

[basslinejunkie]

what about all the people who arent online? i dont think all techno heads are geeks and they don't browse around online looking for the latest speedy j and liebing sets......people are still putting out mixed cd's and vinyl so there must be some sort of market for that right?

lets be honest,virtually every tom,dick an harry has internet access in there house nowadays,and as for cd an vinyl sales,they have decresed dramatically.i dunno about you guys,but i havent brought a mix cd in years....

[danielmarshall]

This is what Chris Liberator has to say about the topic on the inside cover of Set Fire:

"Home taping is killing the music industry. About ****ing time! Tape this off a friend if you can't afford to buy it!"

[danielmarshall]

I might add that I'm quite happy to pay for digital music as long as it's within reasonable finantial bounds. One of the main reasons I quit DJing was that it was simply costing me too much to purchace new vinyl, not to mention finding the records I was after. It used to pain me to have to spend AU$20 for one record for which I only wanted one remix. Getting paid in beer didn't help much either. Whilst I was doing it for the thrill I started to realise that this just wasn't going to work out on my budget.

Now however, it seems that even the smaller record labels are starting to wake up to the idea of digital distribution. The prospect of downloading a track from a web site for a buck or two has seriously got me thinking about buying Live and getting back into it once the industry has grown a bit. Brisbane is slowly becoming more techno orientated too, so maybe I'll get paid in spirits some day!

[rhythmtech]

i can understand why illegal D/Ls are hurting full time artists.. techno sales are hardly gonna sent you double platinum anyway (without the added worry of illegal D/Ls), but for "hobby" producers like myself internet/mp3/p2p etc is the best thing to ever happen. i can get my tracks heard around the world in seconds & i can play them out at gigs without spending stupid amounts on pressings.

i've also basically stopped buying vinyl aswell. i buy mostly mp3 now. vinyl is far too expensive these days. much as i'd love to be able to afford all the latest releases on plastic, i just cant afford to, especially when sites like truelove are selling high quality mp3 for 99p.

[Adey]

The shit dies quicker, the gods rise faster...

I'm loving all the dub plate pressure. boojaka! I did a set last week with tracks completely downloaded off t'internet. fresh, raw and completely legally burnt onto CD'n'whacked into a pair of pioneers.

If you can't make money then you're not good enough to give up the day job or you're living beyond your talent. Simple as that.

If you worry about people pirating then you're as niave as this campaign...
http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/b/bc/Home_taping_is_killing_music.png

never did, did it!

As for record shops shutting down. boo hoo. That's the nature of hobbiests not coping with changing markets.

[The Divide]

:clap: :clap: :clap:

[Mindful]

Personaly Im hearing more music and am able to share my music with others with so much ease.
So to me the music is getting new energy and its more about the music.
People are not making the mony that they were, well its time to change with what is happening, it is not a god given right to make mony from your music anymore but it now seems that I can hear a tune that some guy who ive never heard of from half way across the world has made an hour ago as easyly as I can acsess DJ big name mctechnos latest tune.

To me thats fukkin great.

I may have a different piont if I ran a label or a shop but I dont.
So as The Divide pionted out Music isnt going to die so its just time to adapt.

[Mindful]

Somthing I forgot to add, my kid nephews fave present today is his mp3 player.
Make what you will out of that.

[massplanck]

Somthing I forgot to add, my kid nephews fave present today is his mp3 player.
Make what you will out of that.

He likes music.

[Mindful]

well yes and the way he wants to hear it is thru mp3s.

Im just trying to piont out that kids are in to mp3s and not records,cds,tapes or minidisk.

[massplanck]

Im just trying to piont out that kids are in to mp3s and not records,cds,tapes or minidisk.

thats coz records,cd's,tapes and minidisks cost money. something kids dont have a lot of. ;)

[Mindful]

perhaps.

If so it just enforces the piont that its possibly time to adapt.

[massplanck]

why? coz kids dont have money for music?

[massplanck]

whens he gonna get his first credit card. then we can talk.

[massplanck]

i dont care really but. lets say he is 13, has his mp3 player and can use soulseek. When do you reckon he's gonna buy his first CD with cash or use his credit card on itunes?

[Komplex]

^ I have cash AND love my mp3 player. Anything I buy, leech off friends or find on the net goes straight into the mp3 player *as long as its good. Sets, tracks, the whole lot.

*if its not good it doesn't get to my mp3 player or listened to even if its there on my hard drive. And if its good and I like it, I play it all the time and make sure I support the artists, especially if it's something I haven't bought already... The more obscure and unknown, the more I try to find it and buy it or get in contact with the artist. Maybe its just me but if someone is doing good shit out there, regardless of their brand/name and position in the scene/industry, they deserve to be supported.

*not good tracks include dozens of g*** w****n's tracks that are sitting on my hard drive (along with a heap of others) that I haven't paid a single cent for cus I wouldn't wipe my arse with them. Basicaly a preview of whether to waste the cash or not :) Altho I have bought quite a few records that were good based on what I've heard off the net. So there you go... And I'm actively looking and waiting for a few voidloss tracks to come out so I can pay, mix them guilt free and support (I've messaged you about it too mate :) )

Massplanck - He won't be buying shit as long as he can get away with not paying for it unless hes a cool and awesome dood.

RE: topic - It's a whole lot of publicity and a whole lot of piracy. Double edged sword and its VERY sharp too.

[Adey]

Im just trying to piont out that kids are in to mp3s and not records,cds,tapes or minidisk.

thats coz records,cd's,tapes and minidisks cost money. something kids dont have a lot of. ;)

its more to do with the fact that they have MP3 players

[Adey]

not good tracks include dozens of glen wilson's tracks that are sitting on my hard drive (along with a heap of others) that I haven't paid a single cent for cus I wouldn't wipe my arse with them

lol ahahahhahahaaahah ha

[Komplex]

not good tracks include dozens of glen wilson's tracks that are sitting on my hard drive (along with a heap of others) that I haven't paid a single cent for cus I wouldn't wipe my arse with them

lol ahahahhahahaaahah ha

I didn't write that name, please don't edit my post!

[Mindful]

whens he gonna get his first credit card. then we can talk.

:lol: smart ass

[Adey]

not good tracks include dozens of glen wilson's tracks that are sitting on my hard drive (along with a heap of others) that I haven't paid a single cent for cus I wouldn't wipe my arse with them

lol ahahahhahahaaahah ha

I didn't write that name, please don't edit my post!

go on then, sudoku-boy. If you weren't dissing Glenn Wilison, who were you dissing? and pirating their releases. eh?

[dan the acid man]

if you want a preview of a track to know whether to waste your cash or not as you put it, why dont you do what the rest of us do, go to a record shop and listen, or listen to the mp3 previews on an online shop.

if you really dont like those glen wilson songs you've downloaded for free and stolen (or which ever other artist is it whose first name begins with g and surname begins with w and ends in n) then why still have them on your hard drive.

personally, im all for mp3's, to get your dj sets out there, or your live sets, to sell your latest releases via mp3, but please dont steal them via shareware sites

[Komplex]

Dan - we don't have good record shops where I'm from, we used to have a few but thats another story... and I don't like records all that much.

It used to be easier to cue a whole heap of random tracks off someones slsk collection, download (while doing something else) and preview later, altho these days I just go on the mp3 stores and buy tracks from there, guilt free and only the stuff I want... whichever way people do it, they won't buy it if its shit and thats what I think it all comes down to in the end...

I may be taking the piss and ranting on with my posts but I'm pretty sure that I represent a LOT of people when saying that shit, inlcuding a LOT of people on this board. It's just that nobody else has the balls to say it cus they're too busy licking their heroes' asses.

Happy New Year.

[Komplex]

sorry, before I go to the beach, I have to say something about "getting your dj sets out there"

spank my arse and call me pink cheecks, if thats not blatant piracy, using other people's music without paying any form of royalties while making a name for yourself than I don't know what is...

this is one of the double standards that we often talk about. It's quite a lot worse than downloading someones track off the net, listening to it once or twice and ****ing it off. But I guess it ISN'T piracy if it serves a purpose thats in your favour. **** me. I gotta stop drinking. Lets all record peoples tracks, string them together and spread them round the net, for free... and reap all the rewards of being such a good pirate. arrrrrr.

now I'm being a dick, sorry.

Happy New Year

[basslinejunkie]

good point in my opinion

[dan the acid man]

sorry, before I go to the beach, I have to say something about "getting your dj sets out there"

spank my arse and call me pink cheecks, if thats not blatant piracy, using other people's music without paying any form of royalties while making a name for yourself than I don't know what is...

this is one of the double standards that we often talk about. It's quite a lot worse than downloading someones track off the net, listening to it once or twice and **** it off. But I guess it ISN'T piracy if it serves a purpose thats in your favour. **** me. I gotta stop drinking. Lets all record peoples tracks, string them together and spread them round the net, for free... and reap all the rewards of being such a good pirate. arrrrrr.

now I'm being a dick, sorry.

Happy New Year

no i dont agree with that, if the dj has paid for all the tracks they're playing, and he/she isnt making any money from the sets, i dont see a problem with it at all.

in fact, it helps sales or tracks no end, look how many times people ask the dj, ooh what track is that at 27.36 etc, then they go and buy the record/cd/mp3 etc.

[Miromiric]

if a person downloading illegal mp3s is not making any money on them, i dont see a problem with it at all.

[Sunil]

if a person downloading illegal mp3s is not making any money on them, i dont see a problem with it at all.

Yeah, but if many people couldn't download illegal mp3s (especially DJs), they'd be forced to buy mp3s or go into a record shop, like most other real DJs have done for years.

Granted there's stuff downloaded that the user wouldn't probably buy if they had to, the fact is that people should have to pay for something, surely? Oh no, if they don't make a profit *themselves* then it's ok? :eh: .

[Miromiric]

yep its ok in my book not to buy if u dont earn any money on it.

[lunatrick]

This is what Chris Liberator has to say about the topic on the inside cover of Set Fire:

"Home taping is killing the music industry. About **** time! Tape this off a friend if you can't afford to buy it!"

hmm not sure if he would stand by that statement now....

recently a friend lent me a an mp3 player with 30gigs on it. I copied every single beatles, led zep, pink floyd, bob dylan, oasis albums and a load of other stuff. now to me this is the same thing as nicking from microsoft, these people can blatantly afford it. however there's no way I would have sat down and taped it all onto cassette five years ago, so things have changed. As far as mixes go on the internet, thats fair game I reckon, I've bought all that music and am not charging for it.........

[rotten]

ok but what is it, if ppl cut out trax off the set, remaster it and make it on a record for their personal use/djing?? that'd be an idea for someone i think..

[rotten]

of course i'm talkin bout unreleased stuff

[Miromiric]

that equals to forced penetration.