Starting out.

[Dirtyacid]

Please can you guy,s help??
Im just about to start to produce some techno but what is the best program for starting out??
Im not great with manual,s & I want something simple but affective my computer is massive with memory neither so whats best??

[christian wagner]

Reasons a good starting point,

if you got a mac, use logic, if you got a pc, either cubase or nuendo,( tho reason runs on both)

Fruity loops is supposed to be good nowadays as well.

[rounser]

Get reason, then go to www.reasonstation.net and download some song files, then open them and see how they're made. Very good way to learn (and no other sequencer can really offer that universal compatibility of song files because they all use plugins).

[findthesolution]

i would most definitely start with ableton live. it comes with everything you need to start making music, and has a simple user interface, as well as detailed and easy to understand tutorials built in. the included instruments and effects do not put a lot of strain on your computer either.

[machina]

ableton for sure... is simple to use and is super flexible... the thing it has over the other things like reason etc. is that it's a pretty standard style of program so and as you get deeper into music, everything that you can do in anything else you can do in Ableton. if you get used to reason or fruity etc. and you really start getting into music, you'll find that you quickly have to move on to bigger and better programs and learn an entirely different interface which would be like starting again anyway. plus, it's quite easy to switch from ableton to cubase/logic/sonar if you need to in the future.

machina

[RDR]

Reason every time.

I teach music tech with it. But you must use it inconjunction with another sequencer like cubase SE... something simple.

Here are somethings you should learn in the beginning.

1. Synthesis - this is an absolute foundation of dance music, learn this and it helps.
2. Editting - you've talked about sequencing, but the flip side of the coin everyone forgets is that you must also be able to edit waveforms, and edit them goooood. Try soundforge or wavelab for PC, Peak for Mac.
3. Quantisation and Swing functions. Another essential.
4. Using the right material. Dont use shit sounds... GIGO... garbage in.. garbage out.
5. Learn to use a microphone, mucho fun to be had with a mic

6. EQ
7. Compression

\Dont worry toooo much about those last two until you have got a working knowledge of the others above it... 6 and 7 are exceptionally important, but for your stage exceptionally difficult to grasp. So leave em alone for the moment until you've had fun with the other 5.

;)

[FILTERZ]

I use ableton a lot , but i think for starting out reason is a better bet

my 2 bobs worth

[TechMouse]

4. Using the right material. Dont use shit sounds... GIGO... garbage in.. garbage out.
I dunno, I reckon there's no such thing as a rubbish sound.

Everything can be used somewhere.

[RDR]

4. Using the right material. Dont use shit sounds... GIGO... garbage in.. garbage out.
I dunno, I reckon there's no such thing as a rubbish sound.

Everything can be used somewhere.

Yes, that may be true.. but only if you know what you are doing.. for a beginner what i said stands true.

Also i mean

Well recorded sounds
Nothing with too much hiss in the background.

etc etc etc...

You're being pedantic mr seavers... :roll:

;) but i do take your point, perhaps you could expand on what you mean for old dirty acid...?

:cheese:

[TechMouse]

You're being pedantic mr seavers... :roll:
Par for course, no?


;) but i do take your point, perhaps you could expand on what you mean for old dirty acid...?
Certainly Chrismond.

Basically there is no such thing as a wrong sound.

Even though something may sound incredibly limp or crap upon first listen, that is not the end of the story.

Pitch it up...

Pitch it down...

Make the pitch bend...

Change the envelope shape...

Reverse it...

Loop it up...

Use veloicty to vary volume, filter etc...

... and that's before you even break out the FX :)

Try loading in a load of random samples into Re:Drum in Reason - don't check what they are, just load them in - and then play with each noise using the controls until you get an "interesting" sound.

Now make a pattern.

Welcome to the wonderful world of experimental Techno.

[RDR]

:lol:

Touche.

[dirty_bass]

for starting out, although I love ableton, it`s not the best for midi work for a beginner.
I hate reason, but in temrs of starting out, it really is a great place to start, it`s closed environment, will allow you to focus without too much distraction, and
it will also teach you about routings the old school way (albeit with virtual leads).

Fruityloops may also be a good place to start, but really, go for reason, and when you find you are ready to go onto more complex composition in a totally open environment, then it`s a matter of taste as to which package you go to from there.

[detfella]

on the flipside you could try apps like bidule/audiomulch or trackers like renoise

check this venetian snares video using renoise....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zGK-EzEa45U

i started with cubase and i dont think its too complex for beginners. it gives you opportunity to discover more functions as you learn

[RDR]

Of course the REAL answer is use hardware :lol:


Only kidding... (or am i???)


Why not try them all... then you will be able to decide which one you like best. Thats probably the best for you mate.

[RDR]

Haha

I love trackers, and that venetian snares one is like an excel spreadsheet gone mental..

check out the speed that thing is going... hahahahaha

[machina]

Of course the REAL answer is use hardware :lol:


I honestly think that hardware is easily the best way to learn - if you take the cost out of the equation... having knobs/leads/routings that you can touch and machines with a defined purpose make as gigantic difference in understanding - especially if you are musically minded or have a background (i.e. like to 'play' your instruments rather than 'program' them)...

machina

[RDR]

I wasbeing sarcastic/ironic/a troll.

I swear by hardware synths, wouldnt ever be without one. I just like stirring up hornets nest about this as it doesnt actually matter as long as the sound is good it makes no difference.

[dirty_bass]

exactly.
Most people don`t have the patience or the money for hardware these days anyway.
I started the old shool way, apprenticed in a 100% analog studio and then spent years scavenging and saving up for kit.
It`s a long a difficult path.
If I could have had the technology of now, back then, I would have reached my production standard I am at now, in about a quarter of the time.

[Sinister_Minister]

thanks 4 sharing ur experience guys...i'm new to experimental techno. I have Reason and an x-station. Reason is awesome, I'm learning massive amounts...but then again I didnt know squat other than my ears know what they like ... which is probably the most important factor of all I would guess

. I have to admit though I am disappointed with the onboard soft synths in Reason...the Subtractor is okay and the Malstrom is complete and utter garbage. My X-station has some pretty good voices though. Next purchase is Cubase I guess ...and a 303 ;)

[dirty_bass]

well I think the synths in reason are fine, but they really don`t come with any good presets, so you do have to play with them a lot.

[Elvio Neto]

if you use reason take a look in http://www.reasonstation.net

you can download reffils and presets for all reason machines maked by de community

you can upload your songs for feedback and download songs of any style or substyle

its the best way to start learning to use reason :)

[RDR]

The subtractor is a fabulous synth and as for the maelstrum... you're joking, its amazing. Very different sounding.

BTW read the manual for the both synths... were you aware the subtractor is capable of producing 4 waveforms???? Try using the phase switches and dials and modulating them... its a bloodt monster.

[rounser]

The subtractor is a fabulous synth and as for the maelstrum... you're joking, its amazing. Very different sounding.
Exactly. The subtractor is an excellent synth and has more patches made for it than maybe any other synth, ever....there's just a lot of crap patches out there for it as a result. You can get results from it though; for instance, Mylo says he searched through hundreds of free bass patches he found online before he settled on the ones you hear on his tracks, and they're very phat. Hardware synths and VSTis alike generally have built-in effects, so to compare subtractor fairly to them you should hook up some combination of scream 4, unison, chorus, vocoder in eq mode, reverb and delay in Reason....should make things sound very sick indeed.

IMO, Maelstrom is very good at FX and novel stuff, although it suffers from the problem that most non-subtractive synths do, which is that it's not as easy to program quality bread and butter sounds as on a basic subtractive synth. I don't have the patience for it, nor do I like the patches people generally make with it, which are often difficult to fit into a track; too much effort to get results that can be much better and more easily achieved through a sampler or rompler....but then, I feel that way about most synths.

(I learnt on Reason, but Renoise + ERA suits me better.)

[TechMouse]

check this venetian snares video using renoise....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zGK-EzEa45U

Crikey, that brings back memories...

[dirty_bass]

check this venetian snares video using renoise....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zGK-EzEa45U

Crikey, that brings back memories...

Me too, I started out with MED, and then moved on to OctoMed.
In fact we used to use it as our sequencer playing live in our industrial band, back when I was a drug fueled rock star haha.
The great thing about octamed was that you could load in any file as a sample, games, pictures etc, and it made crazy noises.
8 bit madness.

[TechMouse]

I still have loads of masters of old (shit) tunes I did on OctaMED.

In fact, I still have some tunes which started life on the Amiga version, and I moved them across with CrossDOS.

[Sinister_Minister]

Well there ya go...I've been served. You guys got me all excited about the Reason synths now. Just gotta get in there and screw with the parameters more. Lots to learn. Thank you for the boot in the arse.

[TechMouse]

Well there ya go...I've been served.
Which of course can only mean one thing...

.... It's on.

[TechnoNRGKid]

I agree with dodgyedgy.
Download the demos for a few and see how you like em.
Reason, FL studio and Ableton live i recommend to try out.
I personally started out with FL studio and have many great memories with it.
I think you might like that one. Reason was never a fave for me, although i like the Matrix Sequencer and Subtractor synth.