How many of you actually own Final Scratch?

[Dustin Zahn]

I'm just trying to gauge how f*cked the techno scene is at the moment.

[MARKEG]

hey, what's wrong with final scratch d?

man you have to keep up with technology and not moan about it. well i think so anyway :)

no i dont own it but i'd love to have a fiddle with it....

[DJZeMig_L]

I have only at the shop... fs can only work in 2 decks! Not much point in taking fs + the crates :(

Z

[Dustin Zahn]

I'm not trying to start another flamewar about Final Scratch, I just want to see how many people had it. I'm not nessecarily opposed to it, but I don't think it's something I need at the moment.

Today I spoke to another local DJ and he told me he bought Final Scratch. His reason was "I just spent $200 on records...and I needed to take a break from being broke."

First off, $200 on records isn't shit. I'm tired of people telling me "Hey, I've spent thousands of dollars on records in the past...don't tell me I'm not supporting the techno scene." That one quote in particular came from a friend who bought it last June. He has not bought a single record since. People think because they've spent small fortunes on vinyl it gives them the right to forego supporting the vinyl industry in the future. Give me a break.

Second, all these local DJs are buying Final Scratch when none of them even produce themselves (nor can they mix for that matter). Do they really need Final Scratch? The answer is no unless you just want to rape soulseek for the latest tunes. I run two labels and put out on others and I don't even think Final Scratch is very nessecary for me.

So to sum things up...I just want to know who else out there is buying final scratch? I didn't think it was catching on this quickly.

[dtl]

When I interviewed Glenn Wilson and Martyn Hare, they both mentioned something about a site would be selling their tunes in MP3 in the near future, for like 1 dallors a tune, that means you would be giving the freedom for the first time to skip the shitty b-siders.

But then again, who will actually pay and not know about soulseek? Would the first person who bought the Mp3 be sharing it with the world mintues after? Um...

Well, FS defo has its place for all the classic and rarities I have missed. Too.

Eric.

[Dustin Zahn]

Yeah, I forgot to mention that. FS is also great for old classics and rarities, stuff you can't get anymore or are afraid to bring to the club. The fact is, a lot of these people are just playing the new Zenit or Primate or whatever is popular at the moment.

I'm not opposed to the digial distribution thing either...but seriously, who is going to buy tunes when you can get them for free? Even I find it awfully tempting. Somehow I think that there won't be enough people buying $1 tracks to justify it as a reputable industry. There just isn't enough techno heads anymore.

[scienceofuse]

I think another issue here is the quality of the recording, which is why I think vinyl is going to survive. I've read many discussions about how MP3 DJing is going to root out vinyl, but seriously, I can't see it happening. Correct me if I'm wrong, but I don't think much of the techno music we play is available on MP3 and the sound quality is often questionable. After all, it is a compressed format and even though most punters probably aren't be able to tell the difference, vinyl sounds much much better.

Plus, like ZeMigl said, if you spin on three, you still have to bring records to the gig so FS is really usable only if you produce your own music, which is about the only reason I could think of for buying it...

[GAMMA303]

Yea im not really sure about all this MP3 djing and Final Scratch, I mean i understand why its so great, not having to carry your records around. Man thatd be awesome, vinyl can get so heavy!
But on another note i see all the bad things as well. Sound quality, Stealing music. Now tell me if im wrong but i see a lot of people justifying it for producers who make their own music. thats fine, but why wouldn't they throw their tunes on a couple of CDs and play on a CD turntable.
I too am not trying to start a flame war, im really just curious, is there a big difference between the CD and the MP3? wouldn't an MP3 be worse sounding. and to me i would think if your just playing your tunes from Finaly Scratch why not use a CD turntable and carry a couple extra CDs with you.

and No i don't believe most people will buy downloads when they can get it for free.

[Si the Sigh]

I don't own Final Scratch, but I am very interested in seeing how it all works. It sounds like quite a good idea. I can't see it destryoing vinyl sales as much as some people say. DAVE the Drummer is playing at an event near me soon, and I hear he is using it now, so I might get my train spotting head on & hang around the decks whilst hes playing and see what its all about.

[davethedrummer]

sorry but i've got it
i'm only really using it to play my own productions early though.
as far as sound quality goes its as good as you want it to be.
if you play mp3s it'll sound a bit crap
if you play 44.1/ 16 bit wavs it'll sound pretty good and you even get a little more "tizz" on the tops which you can't get off the vinyl.
i'm really against it being used just to play the latest tracks that you've borrowed off your mates for the day
but for anyone producing it's a pretty cool toy.

however, having said that ,
the wiring nighmare in a club is just a pain in the ass!
the software is still getting sorted out and
ive had real problems with my laptop since final scratch went anywhere near it

so i feel pretty in the middle right now

i spent a lot of money on it and to be honest i haven't used it once at a gig and i don't know if i actually will.

maybe i wasted my time......maybe i just need to spend a bit more time on it........... :?:

[Craig McW]

Vinyl doesn't crash either

[heavy beats]

I'm a fs owner.

embrace technology. :twisted:

[karlo]

dont have it, but mixed on it @ my friend house.Dont like it becaouse that stuff, donat have a soul, especiali` on party! :roll:

[TechMouse]

FS is just another example of a different way of DJing tunes.

Some people moan about CDJ's, on the grounds that "it's not proper DJing" if you're using CD's. Yet most clubs I walk into these days seem to be decked out with them and I've seen loads of big name DJ's using the all the time - and it's definitely a great way to be able to play your own tunes out straight away.

Some people moan about using Traktor on a laptop to DJ, on the grounds that "it's not proper DJing". However, I've seen a lot of people - particularly in the breakbeat scene - use it to devastating effect. Making their own edits of tracks, mashing in acapellas, jumbling up loads of elements on the fly to create something a bit different.

I've even sat and listened to some people moaning about using Ableton Live, because it's not as visually stimulating as watching someone tweaking knobs... or something (mmm, yes, we all go to watch really, don't we)... Yet, in my opinion Ableton Live is one of the most creatively refreshing bits of software to come out in years.

And so, on to Final Scratch.

People moan about it because of the sound quality, because people are stealing the music, and because it may or may not be cheating. The fact is that all of these things are true to some extent, but it also offers up a lot of other possibilities to the DJ that are not available with traditional vinyl alone. (On a side note, it is quite fun to use).

To sum up... I quite like all this new stuff - it keeps life interesting. Everyone (hopefully) can do something a little bit different to everybody else, and music as a whole becomes a bit more varied. Technology bounces forward at a hell of a pace, and I find iit quite interesting and exciting personally.

However, each different person is going to have their own "tolerance level" with reference to how much technology they're prepared to embrace - and I suppose you have to respect that.

[DJZeMig_L]

bring on the new CD by technics or even cdj1000 and I for once won't have much prob in dropping the vynil, sure I'll keep buying. Piracy is a crime and there is no excuse... no lame excuses 4 that.

Z

[xfive]

........Piracy is a crime and there is no excuse... no lame excuses 4 that.

Z
Agreed.
Owning final scratch has never ever stopped me from buying records. The fact of the matter is I love vinyl. I love the feel of it, the designs... all of the effort that is involved in makin it happen.
The benefits to me of having are that I can play gigs across the continent without having to lug around hundreds of pounds of records, and I use it to test tracks with for mixability etc.

Those people who use it purely to "save money" should be ashamed because they are killing the very thing they love.

I am an internet whore as much as anyone else.. but really, come on now.. does downloading an mp3 give you the same warm gushies as having a slab of wax in your hand?

[crime]

I mean i understand why its so great, not having to carry your records around. Man thatd be awesome, vinyl can get so heavy!


You'd still have to carry around final scratch, and have a wireing nightmare when you get to the gig..

I doubt final scratch would survive as well as my records would if my flight case got run over at the airport (This happened to me in malta, box trashed, records inside were fine)

[xfive]

You'd still have to carry around final scratch, and have a wireing nightmare when you get to the gig..

I doubt final scratch would survive as well as my records would if my flight case got run over at the airport (This happened to me in malta, box trashed, records inside were fine)

All ya need is a nice pelican case, which btw, CAN be run over :) They aren't very expensive either.
As far as wiring goes, its really not that bad unless they have it all tied down and such. It's up to the DJ to let the venue know in advance of the requirements. Also practicing in the studio is an easy way to get the flow properly for hooking up FS to a live rig (ie you have to hook it up while someone is playing). Best thing of course is to get to the venue early and hook it all up.. sound check etc ;)

[g]

if you play mp3s it'll sound a bit crap
that's just plain not true. especially if you use 256k files, but arguably no one can tell the difference with 192k. and consider the fact that most club sound systems are mono pieces of crap.

but to the other point, there's nothing about FS that says you have to use mp3s at all.

[davemoore]

IF I NEW WOT U ARE JIBBERING ON ABOUT THEN I MIGHT SAY SOMETHING USEFULL BUT AS I DONT I WILL TRY TO SHUT UP NOW BUT IT DONT SEEM TO BE HAPPINING :doh:

[g]

regarding who'll pay for mp3s if they are available:

itunes music store
nufonix.com
beatport.com
audiolunchbox.com
trax2burn.com
warprecords.com/bleep
epitonic.com
foryourears.com (eventually)

i buy mp3s. i buy vinyl. actually, now i buy more music than ever before b/c the mp3s i buy are 99% other genres, stuff i don't play as much, stuff i was always curious about but didn't want to start buying in vinyl, etc etc.. so actually the existence of pay-for-download mp3s has greatly expanded my overall playlist(s).

all that being said, the single greatest thing about FS (imo) is still the one that gets talked about the least: customization. personalization. immediacy. zahn can make his Lost Boys track one afternoon and play it out that night. maybe never play it out again, make that gig that much more unique for the people who were lucky enough to be there. let's say you're a producer: what better way to test a track in a club environment that to actually *play* it in the club. no waiting, no goddamn acetates. try out x-number of different versions, eq settings, mastering passes before you actually commit the track to being done. or maybe do the exact same thing but with your mate's track... your mate who happens to live on the other side of the planet. and you play the track he made that afternoon. really dig that new ____ track you bought? ...except the vocal or the break or the bassline or the whatever? edit your own version, play that one. how many of us went nutty over the custom edits in those 2 surgeon sets from last september? and so on.

[dan the acid man]

IF I NEW WOT U ARE JIBBERING ON ABOUT THEN I MIGHT SAY SOMETHING USEFULL BUT AS I DONT I WILL TRY TO SHUT UP NOW BUT IT DONT SEEM TO BE HAPPINING :doh:

its a piece of software and hardware that you load mp3's, wav's etc into and using it with your decks and some special records you can play them just like you would vinyl, instead of changing the records you drag and drop the next tune you require.

Ive had a play about with it at work and it seems to cause more problems than its worth to be honest.

[g]

Ive had a play about with it at work and it seems to cause more problems than its worth to be honest.
always interested by these comments. more problems how so? it's bulletproof for me.

[dan the acid man]

it wouldnt update, we then tried a manual update and that didnt work, we then reinstalled it and now this week its not giving us the option to choose linux or windows, to be honest it may not be the software as its used by kids at a college i work at, so as you can imagine it gets alot of abuse

[xfive]

Ive had a play about with it at work and it seems to cause more problems than its worth to be honest.
:shock:


always interested by these comments. more problems how so? it's bulletproof for me.

Same here. I have used it for continuously on many occasions.. once for 8 hours straight at a house party.. just let people come up and pick whatever they wanted to spin, or stick cds in, and the only time it goofed was when someone tried to put a bad cd in and load a track off it.

Never crashed once otherwise.

-Chris

[DJZeMig_L]

PS- Whatch out 4 the new Serato/ Rane ... very much on the same leage as FS but it can b preatty amazing I hear!

;)

Z

[xfive]

PS- Whatch out 4 the new Serato/ Rane ... very much on the same leage as FS but it can b preatty amazing I hear!

;)

Z

Yah I saw that one too....
The one that really intrigues me though is Ms. Pinky (http://www.mspinky.com/)
Way cheaper than FS..

[g]

PS- Whatch out 4 the new Serato/ Rane ... very much on the same leage as FS but it can b preatty amazing I hear!

;)

Z

Yah I saw that one too....
The one that really intrigues me though is Ms. Pinky (http://www.mspinky.com/)
Way cheaper than FS..
not when you factor in that the 'scratch amp' equivalent is not provided w/ ms. pinky. you have to buy some preamps or a sound card with sufficient i/o or some combination thereof. i love the source of that ms. pinky software but the notion that it's so much cheaper is misleading.

[TechMouse]

Can FS run through Windows now, or is it still reliant on Linux?

[g]

there's now a windows native version.
if you can call anything in windows native...

the osx version is so freakin stable tho. feels like the BeOS version.

[Tony]

yeah, we have it at our flat. my flatmates work in pro audio store so we got the first ones in the country (after the a list superstars are givien theirs of course) its fun, and quite hrizon broadening. hey, i can rewrite a chris mccormack tunes so they have more structure and fit in to sets etc. my pal constructs his own battle vinyl for scratching etc, good shit man!!!

[crime]

. hey, i can rewrite a chris mccormack tunes so they have more structure and fit in to sets etc.

I take it you hold McCormack's arrangement in high esteem then.... :roll:

[xfive]

PS- Whatch out 4 the new Serato/ Rane ... very much on the same leage as FS but it can b preatty amazing I hear!

;)

Z

Yah I saw that one too....
The one that really intrigues me though is Ms. Pinky (http://www.mspinky.com/)
Way cheaper than FS..
not when you factor in that the 'scratch amp' equivalent is not provided w/ ms. pinky. you have to buy some preamps or a sound card with sufficient i/o or some combination thereof. i love the source of that ms. pinky software but the notion that it's so much cheaper is misleading.

I guess I said that because I think most everyone who has a laptop for audio purposes has the sort of sound i/o you mention already anyhow.
Regardless.. Ms Pinky costs $100.. so adding on something like a Quattro for < $200 is still cheaper than FS.

[Rhys]

I have a question.

Say you've got it set up in a club and are doing a set using it, is it easy to from final scratch to vinyl and vice-versa ie is it easy to take the special record things off and use good old vinyl in the middle of your set or is it the case that you have to only use FS or only use vinyl the whole time?

[Methodixxx]

Rhys - you just click it over to "phono" instead of "line in" on the mixer... and just deselect the little "F" button on the final scratch program... Ta-da! ;)



I might have a whirl on it for a few tracks tonight as a mate will be using it the set after me and I wouldn't mind trying out one of Ferny's new tunes and some other stuff I've been sent thats a long way away from making it to vinyl... :love:

[speed-it-up]

I've used it in my set at parties before no bother.

Is a little bit more hassle to select the tune on the laptop first and download it to the final scratch disc.

I like the fact that you can drop unreleasd stuff into your set and mix it like any other piece of vinyl.

As Dave said, provided you have a high bitrate sample there is no noticable deterioration in sound quality.

A lot of wires to plug in though!

[DJZeMig_L]

Stanton has a project for equiping some choosen clubs with resident scratch amps, so u'd only need 2 plug yer pc/ mac and the usb cable... tolled them this 4 ages.. finally they've realised it could b used (obviously lots of people have made the same request)...

Z

[The Overfiend]

bring on the new CD by technics or even cdj1000 and I for once won't have much prob in dropping the vynil, sure I'll keep buying. Piracy is a crime and there is no excuse... no lame excuses 4 that.

Z :clap: I also stand behind Dustin's statement at least for the states that there just are not people with a thirst for techno anymore. Eminem has corrupted the youth of america.

[DJZeMig_L]

it's a cycle give it time and it come back u again! :)

Z

[crime]

Yo you may wanna check this out...

http://www.mspinky.com

[jonnyspeed]

Traktor rocks! But still in 2s about FS